| Author | Message | ||
     Court |
I'm having a tough time buying into the "Jeremy says what he's paid to say". . . but okay. Now, how are we going to reconcile the braking performance he demonstrated on the bike? I guess he could say "I was braking better than the bike was physically capable of just to make it look good". For those of us who watched him at Daytona, the pain of the DNF was partially offset by some of the shining moments, both on the throttle and on the brakes. Court P.S. - I'd likely concur with some of his comments about the Buell Racing effort. There was some of that, some of the sucky stuff, that was beyond Buells control unfortunately. | ||
| Blake |
No engine is good enough to win a high level championship in and of itself. The XBRR, given equal funding, development, testing, tires, riders, is absolutely good enough to win in AMA Formula Xtreme. Of that I have no doubt. The disparity between Buell racers and the factory teams with their extensive development, funding, and tires is HUGE. You ask how the XBRR is so good if it cannot win in AMA FX. Well I say it could if given equal support and talent as the factory efforts. I counter that how is it that you view the XBRR so dimly when on equal footing it has beaten the likes of Ducati's and Aprilia's best? Matt, even Buell recognized the need on high speed and hard braking venues to develop a better brake caliper. They agree with you on that. I don't understand the relentless resurection of that point, especially in the context of the XBRR; it doesn't use the stock caliper. I got to know Jeremy a little last year during testing at Texas World Speedway where he was running right at the outright motorcycle track record, yeah, the one set by AMA Professional racers on their IL4 superbikes. I don't see Jeremy as the type to bullshit. He is 100% professional, serious, and accurate in his technical evaluations of racing machines. He had other very serious criticisms for other aspects of the XBRR. It wasn't just Jeremy who lauded the XBRR brake, it was also Mike Cicotto, Steve Crevier, Dan Bilansky, and Don Canet of Cycle World. It is beyond uncool to imply that Jeremy was being disingenuous when describing to me, not a Buell employee, not even close, the performance of the XBRR front brake. When I asked Steve Crevier about his opinion of the XBRR front brake, his initial response was, "gee, you know, I didn't even notice it." Which is in truth the absolute highest compliment any racer can pay to the performance of a braking system. I understand your frustration at the racing situation in the motherland, but Matt, that is another issue entirely. Buell cannot force people to go racing. LOL. And a lack of Buells in UK racing is in no way an indictment of the capabilities of the XBRR. The folks in France are proving that. Congratulations to the French Pro-Twins Buell racers and their four out of four victories! | ||
| Rocketman |
I counter that how is it that you view the XBRR so dimly when on equal footing it has beaten the likes of Ducati's and Aprilia's best? . . . . . . . . . . . . . . .and quietly from the distance, a small voice was heard to say . . . . . . . . . . . .THEY WERE NOT DUCATI'S AND APRILIA'S BEST. Just some raced up streetbikes in a French national race series BadWeB would never have heard of if there were no Buells in it. That said, I'm pleased that there are those here who think this is a wonderful achievement for the XBRR's. I'm just not one of them. I'm a realist. Rocket | ||
| Court |
.........and their visors were fogged | ||
| Rocketman |
The real fog is more clear to see. If everyone here took off their Buell hat, pretty much like Matt has, and such acts from a well experienced racer and one who has put his money where Buell racing is concerned in the UK (a Buell target market), then perhaps Buell might see how poor their token gesture at racing to satisfy the boss's whim is. At least if everyone had the balls to say the XBRR is a massive let down, Buell might come back with the real deal. A racer that will shut everyone's mouth up by winning in anything but an egg and spoon race. Somehow though, I doubt it. Buell aren't in racing because their dedicated fans believe they are. Isn't it easy to satisfy some. Next you know, the Buell dedicated will be telling us Buell have built the worlds best dirt bike. Wait for it. Such comments are coming. Nothing can hold back such passion. Not even the truth. Rocket | ||
| Jimidan |
I think we need to remember that Matt is not some typical Buell-hating troll...he has been there and done that. What he says has merit and the weight of all of his experience racing Buells. Who here amongst us has done anything even close? I thought so... | ||
| Madduck |
Speeking of Buell hats, I just won the pink hat on Matts auction. Yea me. Not only do I wsear a Buell hat, I get new ones regularly. Haven't been around as long as Court, but I still own and race my first Buell, 1995 S2. We are seriously thinking of going after 200 mph on gas with my FBRAT ULY. Now that is seriously over the top. Even more crazed than the TeamElves effort. But thats why they hold races and write rule books, it encourages people like me and a lot of others to see just where that limit has moved to today. | ||
| Rocketman |
Paul, we are not talking about Buell building a platform that can be had by anyone, and transformed by people like you, into a 200+ mph monster. We are talking here of a Buell built series of racing motorcycles that have not lived up to anywhere near (by a very long way) what those at Buell told the motorcycling world it would. It's in poor taste that Buell representatives come to a Buell forum and whip up the Buell hat wearers into a frenzy over four race wins somewhere in France where Buell most likely never heard of until those four wins. Everyone, and not just the Buell hat wearers were lead to believe so much more was coming. This is an all to often scenario where Buell are concerned, be it street bike, race bike, or what's next? Heaven forbid, not a world beating Buell dirt bike? Do you imagine we'll be on the BadWeB in coming months arguing the merits of the Buell dirt bike? I do. I know already it won't live up to expectations. That's because Buell talk up their products (always)then come up with excuse after excuse after excuse as to why some of the Buell faithful seem let down. Usually Harley Davidson will be the focus of blame for holding Mr Buell back, or not providing funds so needed to prove Buells can win if they went racing. Or the other most likely scenario will be, one of Buells new dirt bikes will win a race or two against some strong competition, and such winning will be held up as a massive 'told you so' by those blinkered Buell hat wearers who'd have it no other way. This is about Buell going racing - which they don't. It's not about the likes of your good self using a much modified Buell platform to live out your own passions, or like minded people as you doing similar. This is about Buell building street bikes that Buell fans want. It isn't about Buell jumping into different categories of types of motorcycle based around a singular platform, then selling them to Buell hat wearers as the greatest invention on two wheels. It's about Buell not building the types of motorcycles they should be doing to keep up with the rest of the field. It's about a small innovative motorcycle company that should be out there with world beating street bikes, and not one that relies heavily on its innovative designs to dress up an out of date platform fast in need of replacement, or a super Buell model to sell alongside it. Rocket | ||
| Trojan |
I think we need to remember that Matt is not some typical Buell-hating troll Thank you Jimi  It is precisely because I am so intensely passionate about Buells that I get so frustrated and angry sometimes. I want to see a world beating Buell racer as much as the next man, but I resent being called a Buell hater by someone who hides behind the cloak of an anonymous signature. I speak to Buell owners all day every day, and there are a number of common issues that crop up time and time again, and which the factory and the dealer network appear to be in complete denial of. The most common of these gripes are: Warped from rotors, broken belts, failed wheel bearings. The dealer network and Buell UK seem to have adopted a Blackadder like 'Deny everything' mentality regarding these issues, and it is undeniably losing Buell customers. | ||
| Jimidan |
Frankly, I'm sick and tired of coming to BadWeB for a little recreation and having to read people being derided and Buell being belittled. I wish you would stop it. Nod-nod, wink-wink, if you know what I mean!  } | ||
| Anonymous |
Nope, Matt is special, he's a typical "British" Buell hating troll! Although he has raced a Buell, which sets him light years above Rocketman, who only races his mouth. But believe me, there are people here with more experience racing Buells than Matt has, and with way more success. Hey, Rocketman, if Buell builds such absolute shiite that their customers hate, how come we've sold 100,000 of 'em? Post here after you've sold 100,000 of those V8 yellow and chartreuse beauties. What a bunch of pontificating posers you trolls are!} | ||
| Trojan |
Nope, Matt is special, he's a typical "British" Buell hating troll! Although he has raced a Buell, which sets him light years above Rocketman, who only races his mouth. How brave of you to once again hide your true identity behind your anonymous signature. If you want to put me down at least have the common decency and the courage to come out of the closet and tell us who you are. At least I have the courage of my convictions to stand up and tell people who I am and what I stand for and believe in. My credentials are here for all to see. I don't nee to hide. I have spent 9 years building a successful Buell business from nothing, We work 12 hours a day every day promoting Buell products and speaking directly to Buell owners and customers, so I have quite a lot of experiance in what people are happy and unhappy with. We have probably done more to promote the Buell brand inthe UK than all of the franchised dealers put together over the last few years, and certainly much more than Buell UK have ever done. We have built Buell show bikes and race bikes and have won a national club championship with an XBR. I spent 9 months of 2005 planning, organising and administering the brand new UK Thunderbike race series just so people could have somewhere to race a buell int he UK that would be competitive. During that time I had 'firm comittments' from 7 UK dealers that they would run bikes in the series. Not a single one had the comittment or passion to actually do it though, leaving us as the ONLY Buell racer in the country. Personally I think we did a good job, but if you can do better please don't let me stop you. By the way, the UK Thunderbike series goes from strength to strength and is now a popular fixture on the UK club racing calendar, featuring an ecclectic and interesting mix of bikes from Laverda 750 to Aprilia SVX550 and just about every other bike in between. Exept Buells, not one. Buell UK were given the opportunity to sponsor the whole race series in 2006 for the sum of £10,000 (around 1 percent of H-D UK's advertising budget I believe), but declined because they'couldn't afford it'. I don't doubt for one minute that there are lots of people with more experience and more success than me in running Buell race bikes, and some of them have been very helpful to us with advice and helo over the years, which I appreciate greatly. BY the way, I am also in a pretty unique position on this board as we also have a successful aftermarket parts business for other 'non Buell' sports bikes, so it is very interesting to compare just what people spend on their bikes and in what areas. One of the most popular options for Buell owners is brake upgrades, wave rotors, upgraded master cylinders, upgraded pads etc. On the other hand we sell almost no brake upgrades for othe rbikes s there is no demand for them. What does this tell you? Owners of Jap/Euro sports bikes buy exhausts and cosmetic parts more than anything else, whereas Buell owners spend more money on making the bike work better in the braking/engine depatment than it is when they buy it straight from the dealer. Buell owners have more complaints about their offically franchised dealers than the other owners too, and I speak to far more disillusioned Buell owners (and ex Buell owners) than for other brands. If the factory choose to deny or ignore these facts then that is not my problem is it | ||
| Mark_in_ireland |
Quote....What a bunch of pontificating posers you trolls are!} and yourself anon troll... what a spineless excuse of a person who hides behind the anon and spouts off stupid snide comments everynow and then. You Buell types remind me of the Stepford Wifes movie....strewth, anyone thinks out of the buell box....i.e rose tinted glasses off....quick get them in for reprogramming. Contrary to what you think there are quite a lot of people interested in 'outside the box' comments, although if you had your way and the half a dozen thorns in your side were moved on, or like me who just got fed up banging my head against a brickwall and left, buell would be in their element...no dissention in the ranks....everyone loves us..... GET REAL...like I said previously, Sean and Matt, a breath of fresh air in a farmyard of stale manure. | ||
| Anonymous |
Hey, another British troll lines up! Spineless we are not. The spineless ones are those of you who deride and speak arrogantly, but have done nothing. There is a corporate directive for Buell related employees not to post, so we have to stay anaonymous, but our work speaks for itself. Yours does not. So get a spine. Build a bike if you know so much. Let's see how long before 100,000 Rocketmobiles are sold. Fresh air? Hardly. Drunken boasts and threats at the pub is all I smell from your end. | ||
| Rubberdown |
Why even bother with the anony types. Without identity, there is no credibility. | ||
| Trojan |
There is a corporate directive for Buell related employees not to post, so we have to stay anaonymous, but our work speaks for itself. We only have your word for that though don't we? For all we know you could be the Buell factory toilet cleaner or just somebody who likes to stir things up on the internet with nothing to back it up at all. What is Buell frightened of that they have to gag their employees? | ||
| Austinuu |
Anonymous or not your words are a direct reflection on your company, and honestly I don't believe bashing over the pond webbers a good enough excuse to be able to hide behind the "Anon" tag. | ||
| Court |
Me? . . I've been coyly hiding behind by real name on the internet for 14 years and I'm buying very little of this wholesale negativity. I have admiration and respect for Matt's opinion, particularly having founded, grown and run a small business. It's a tough go, not matter the product or service. Matt's gotten off his arse and done something. That distinguishes him amongst the current arguants. I read and consider Matt's posts and believe quite strongly that his opinions are honest and honestly stated. Respecting a person does not obligate me to accept their opinion. . . only to read and consider. Read the words. . . ignore the names . . the facts are the same. Buell's had some great accomplishments and been smacked accross the face a couple times. . . from the day I started bracket racing an Olds 4-4-2 in 1971 . . . well mates, that's the game of racing. Court (yeah . . Mom named me after an English race car driver, can you believe it?) | ||
| Steve_a |
I'd suggest that Blake lock this thread; this is degenerating fiercely. We at Buell welcome constructive criticism, but this thread degenerated into name calling a long time ago. The XBRR was built to provide a basis for privateer racers to race Buells, and, as such, it has its pluses and negatives. I still stand by the statement that it is the fastest air-cooled Twin around a road circuit; certainly no MGS-01 or BMW boxer we've seen can come close, and perhaps Jens will demonstrate this convincingly in German Twins racing later this year -- at the factory level, we're not racing the RR, having elected to concentrate our engineering resources on other things that should delight Buell enthusiasts. We've learned lessons from the RR you'll see applied elsewhere, and we're still working on making it better, as some of the racers who own one can tell you. On the specific point of the 8-piston caliper and the ZTL2 brake system: I asked Jeremy McWilliams after each race and test session about each system of the bike, and the one he never complained about was the brake. He did indeed compare the ZTL2's feel and power to that of Moto GP brake systems. It's available now to any racer who wants it. | ||
| Reepicheep |
Thanks Steve, thats a nice clear and simple post. Great contribution. Looks like racing brings out a lot of passion in racers. | ||
| Bison |
While I am not the rider I am the owner of a XBRR that is racing. I don't have unlimited resources so maybe our effort is less than it could be. We are doing the best that we can with our resources.We have had our problems but are quite happy to be racing the RR. Walt has changed jobs and we will be contesting the balance of the FX races this year. We have had very good support from Buell as a privateer and I thank them. Having said that I am so tired of the bs that comes from Rocket I feel I must comment. I don't wear the Buell hat exclusively but chose to buy the RR because of my love for my Ulysses which is the most enjoyable bike I own. I own a number of motorcycles and have ridden and raced for over 50 years.I presently drag race as well as compete in Long Distance events. I will be doing my fourth Iron Butt Rally this August. I also hold the "Trans Americas" world record of 21 days 2 hours and 8 minutes from Prudhoe Bay AK to Ushuaia Argentina. I write this not to blow my horn but to establish my background and credibility to post my comments. The title of this Forum does have the word Enthusiast's in it. I would agree that this should not mean that no dissenting opinions are allowed. In my opinion the majority of Rocket's post's are not even dissenting opinions but just bs bashing of mainly the Buell company and any body that might enjoy Buell. I am aware that I am free to delete or not read but strongly wish that he would either be constructive is his comments or cease his bs on this list. Racing A Buell XBRR and very happy about it. regards ref | ||
| Rocketman |
It might not be the largest facility in the world, but I do own outright my workshop and the land it stands on, and all the equipment inside it. I owe nothing to anyone. The bills are paid up to date. No mortgage. No bank loan. No overdraft. I'd consider that getting off my arse and doing something, f*ck you very much. Further more, I haven't had to sell my soul to a corporate giant to make a go of it. No matter. It won't change the misrepresentations made by Buell about its products and its 50 odd race bikes. Rocket | ||
| Rocketman |
I don't wear the Buell hat exclusively but chose to buy the RR because of my love for my Ulysses which is the most enjoyable bike I own. That sounds very much like wearing a Buell hat to me. I've said it before. Show where I've bashed the Buell company? What you should be asking, as a lover of your Buell motorcycles, is for your beloved Buell to answer the questions I ask that have the anonymous gang throwing blatant personal insult after insult in my direction. Let's see the build cost of the cash cow Blast, as promised, and prove Rocket wrong? Tell us the magic that makes the XB frames superior handling characteristics undecipherable to other motorcycle designers, and prove Rocket wrong? Let's hear how the XBRR is pushing Buell development forward with their street bikes, and prove Rocket wrong? Let's see this new super Buell that's going to beat the world, and prove Rocket wrong? Tell us how Buell are going to be a major force in world racing within (less than) five years, and prove Rocket wrong? I'm one of the few here who ask the questions some want answered. If you're not one of them, and you don't like my comments, go buy a Suzuki. And by the way, have you actually crossed the Darrian Gap or just boat ridden your way around it? Thought not! Rocket | ||
| Doerman |
I don't get it Rocket. What's the matter. I get your point regarding 50 bikes and perhaps a overenthusiastic view as to what could be achieved with them. Ok. You have made that point. But why be so incredibly negative about it? For me, the 50 bikes made for a lot of fun and is still generating fun in racing participation in various corners of the world. What is so bad about that. I believe you have attempted to make your point on that topic, so no answer is expected. Could the effort have been better? I am sure it could. Hindsight is always 20-20. The good part about this is that Buell put a foot forward, and tasted fun. It remains to be seen, but I think it has fueled the Enthusiast Inc (aka Buell) to do more with a racing program and what is more important, build a better, stronger and more fun bike for me to buy in the future. I am looking forward to what will happen next as the adventure continues. Cheers Asbjorn | ||
| Reepicheep |
Rocket, your facility is a joke, your work is junk, and your business will never amount to anything but some sort of marginal shop working on a marginal brand and and preying on unwary consumers. There. How did that feel? I have no idea if it's true or not, I don't really care. My point is just that you seem to feel free to take random potshots at somebodies life work and passion just for sport. Of course the target will take it as a personal attack... it *is* a personal attack. If the Elves were in it for the money, they would have been out of it (with the money) a long time ago. It's their passion, their life work. I was here from the start of the XBRR program, and followed it every step of the way. I never had the impression it was anything but remarkably open grassroots level of factory support for *any* privateer team that wants to make a go of racing Buells. The really cool thing about it was that *anybody* could step up and give it a go... not just individuals that have sucked up in all the right ways for enough years to their Asian overlords. If other people came to some other conclusion, perhaps Buell can be faulted for not being more explicit, or maybe others can be faulted for not paying careful attention to what was being said, I don't really care. | ||
| Rocketman |
My business supplies my customers with exactly what it says on the tin. I don't make false promises. I don't compare my efforts next to those of more superior business in an attempt to gain favour amongst my customers. This isn't about me. It's about a motorcycle company that year in year out promises so much then refuses to deliver. Some of us are sick of such false hope. I speak perhaps for them. It's a dirty job but someone has to do it. Rocket | ||
| M1combat |
"I was here from the start of the XBRR program, and followed it every step of the way. I never had the impression it was anything but remarkably open grassroots level of factory support for *any* privateer team that wants to make a go of racing Buells. The really cool thing about it was that *anybody* could step up and give it a go... not just individuals that have sucked up in all the right ways for enough years to their Asian overlords. " Exactly... | ||
| Court |
Steve and Dick: Thank you from Buell Enthusiasts around the world for all you have accomplished and are presently accomplishing. I can not imagine any two names in concert representing greater credibility within the industry and sport. I'm closing my portion of this thread content in the knowledge that Steve nailed it with the allusion to the reallocated resources. I suspect time, rather than tirade, will eventually lay this discussion to rest. Thanks to both of your for your time and contribution. Court | ||
| Blake |
I agree that Sean (Rocketman) has behaved like a complete jackass in this thread as from the very start he was making false statements and belittling the success of the French Buell racers and Buell racing in general. Sean, you are my friend. You are also WAY out of line here. This thread was about congratulating the significant success of the French Buell racers, two of them, who are doing extremely well racing against a field of Aprilia RSV and Ducati 1098, 999, and 998 machines. I guarantee that if prior to their winning the last four French Pro-Twins races you had been asked how the XBRR teams would have faired, you would never ever have predicted or thought possible their amazing success, four wins in the last four races. No one is whipping anyone up into any kind of frenzy. It seems that you perceive any congratulatory or enthusiastic statements concerning a Buell racer's success as "whipping up a frenzy". It's not, it is what it is, congratulatory recognition for those who have achieved such admirable success in racing. If you go back and read your opening comments to this thread, you'll find that they include inaccuracies and are absurdly negative. No one likes a naysaying ninny, which is what you've made yourself into in this thread and others of similar topic. I think Matt is genuine in his statement above. I don't think he's a troll at all. He's helped a lot of BadWeBrs with sound technical advice/information. However, I also think Matt is taking his frustrations out on the wrong folks and tends to be a bit too stubborn on some issues; possibly some ego in play there?  Trust me, I know stubborn and I know ego. ![: ]](http://www.badweatherbikers.com/buell/clipart/proud.gif) Matt's certainly earned some right to his frank commentary through his TrojanHorse/Adrenaline Moto UK racing championship campaigning a Buell Firebolt. The man obviously has credibility and expertise from which to view issues concerning Buell Racing. But I think Matt may be overstepping the realm of professional decorum due to stubbornness and a bit of sour grapes. We all may be guilty of that at some level.  Thoughtful communication is the best solution. That which we assume about the intent of others is sometimes not accurate. I think Matt, as he has said, is deeply disappointed with a lack of support for UK racing by Buell UK and also from Buell dealers in the UK. I'm not sure he understands that the Buell Racing folks here in America share his disappointment and are working as best they can to turn that situation around. But first and foremost they are responsible for helping Buell racers in America. Hopefully Buell Racing support for Euro and other non-American racing series will grow and succeed. The stalwart British manner of frank communication certainly loses much in translation into American, especially via writing. Having spent a significant part of my professional career working very closely with the British, I learned that the tone of their communications does not always translate accurately. I've been on both sides of the misinterpretation of tone issue, just ask my Japanese friends at Toshiba or the Pakistanis I worked with in the Persian Gulf. I cannot imagine how many times I must have made comments or unwitting gestures that to less understanding folks in Japan would have been very insulting. I even once caused some trouble with the Italians on Statten Island--who knew that indicating the number "2" via a backhanded peace sign was an insult--and my Grandmother was full Italian! I've learned a BUNCH of valuable lessons from trying to understand and adapt to such cultural differences. As to the anonies posting here, please don't think for one second that they are hiding behind their anonymity. I can assure you they would speak just as frankly in person. The simple fact is that none of the anonies could participate here as they do without anonymity, and it would be our significant loss if they were unable to do so. I don't think it is fair to expect anonymi to refrain from engaging in vigorous discussion because of their situation. I think we also might ought to try to understand that if/when we harshly critisize (insult, berate and belittle) BMC and/or their motorcycles, or appear to do so, that there are real flesh and blood folks who personally feel very intensely the prick of such barbs and arrows. It just ain't constructive, not at all. As Court says, that kind of negative dialogue pretty much compels those who feel attacked to ignore anything further, no matter how valid, that we might have to contribute. Yeah despite Sean's delusions of somehow affecting Buell operations. LOL. | ||
| Blake |
Sean, What false promises has Buell made? Name one and provide the quoted reference.  Your close to being banned again. Step back and think. If you feel so strongly about the issue, I suggest you put it on paper and send it to Erik Buell in writing. Bill nailed it. You are WAY out of line. If placating your ego is more important than maintaining my respect for you, keep on as you are. My respect for you has diminished significantly. Your behavior is unfortunate. Did Buell advertise their product as having a 17,500 rpm rev limit when it in truth was only some 16,000 odd rpm? That wasn't just a false promise, it was a blatant lie, a lie that sold a LOT of motorcycles and generated a BUNCH of hype. |
