| Author | Message | ||
     Jscott |
http://www.superbikeplanet.com/2006/Nov/061113s.ht m Hey check out my post from 8.24.06 in this thread http://www.badweatherbikers.com/buell/messages/158 664/221956.html?1163511244 I never new I had such pull in the motorcycle racing community.  Now if I could only get Buell to listen. | ||
| Jimidan |
I always knew you were smart. jimidan | ||
| Jscott |
Thanks Jimidan! Likewise! | ||
| Vagelis46 |
I wish Erik Buell gets a 749 engine from Ducati, mount it on the XB and win the FX series.I am sure the chassis is up to the task. BIMOTA has done it. Why not BUELL? They will actually save money, since they will stop trying to make the 1340cc complete the race with no problems. But then this is my opinion. Also I would have to spend money to get a satelite dish, stay awake at night and watch the series. GO BUELL !!! | ||
| Jetrider802 |
If ducati can make it last for 200+ miles, daytona will be a very cool race. The AMA needs to continue to work with the rule book so that we can here more then the scream of jap bikes, and a couple of buells. you only here the buells for about 3-4 laps on average though. (Message edited by jetrider802 on November 14, 2006) | ||
| Davegess |
This is very cool. Maybe we can get the 200 to be an important race again. Seems like the manufactures are stepping up. Makes it tougher for Buell to win but hey it is overall a good thing. | ||
| Blublak |
Hmmm.. Got it from a very good source.. We may be seeing that ole' opposed twin draggin' around the track. BMW is looking at getting into FX next year. As always, folks start to follow where Buell leads.. Think about it.. FX will be THE class to watch. Don't ya think? | ||
| Jscott |
Looks to be a GO!!! "Larry Pegram's Ducati 749 FX effort has been bludgeoned right off the bell with the teams's bikes being stuck in US Customs at the moment. The Ohio-based team and rider will miss this test but will be running Dunlop tires this season." http://www.superbikeplanet.com/2006/Dec/061204z.ht m | ||
| Jscott |
Still stuck in customs... http://www.superbikeplanet.com/2006/Dec/061205b.ht m | ||
| Jscott |
"Pistal is currently working on an 848 kit for the 749R..." http://www.roadracingworld.com/news/article/?artic le=27725 Coincidence? I think not. | ||
| Jimidan |
Nice finds J, I don't think it is a coincidence either. At least with Pegram in there, I will have someone to cheer for at FX races. What about; "...Spies will race the Superstock and Superbike classes this season) and Mat Mladin testing what appears to be his 2006 Superbike. Interestingly Mladin is running the number one plate on his machine and Spies eleven on his Superstocker." In modern times it is almost unheard of for the Superbike champ to run in a support class. Go Ben. Then Mladin getting to fun the #1 plate too. Stranger than fiction. jimidan | ||
| Jscott |
FX podiums are possibly there for the taking if an outside manufacturer is willing to step up to the plate. It looks as though perhaps Ducati has seen that very opening (although I do believe that I was the one that pointed it out to them ). I'll be pulling for Pegram as well. Plus the "Worm" is a good ole' native Ohioan as well. As a side note I received an email back from Martin Moto (a dealer team that has raced the Triumph 675 successfully last year) and they will not be participating in FX this year, but stated that "We are working toward this goal of racing in the AMA". | ||
| Jscott |
Yeah baby! All is not lost in FX... http://www.roadracingworld.com/news/article/?artic le=27732 | ||
| Jimidan |
...but in my heart I know that an 850cc Ducati isn't going to be podium material any more than the XBRR. But that didn't stop me form cheering on McWilliams and Crevier... and it won't stop me from cheering on the worm. jimidan | ||
| Reepicheep |
The only thing I would like to see more then Buell mixing it up and competing strongly in FX would be Buell, Ducatti, MotoGuzi, and BMW mixing it up and competing strongly in FX. It'd just be fun. No other reason. | ||
| Jscott |
And let's not forget Triumph! BMW is rumored to do a couple of one offs this year, and possibly fulltime in 08. If Ducati stays, Triumph and BMW get in, and Buell returns, the 08 season will be one not to miss. | ||
| Jimidan |
Reepicheep sez: would be Buell, Ducatti, MotoGuzi, and BMW mixing it up and competing strongly in FX." At least they could compete strongly against each other...  jimidan (Message edited by jimidan on December 06, 2006) | ||
| Blake |
Jimi, Ain't it amazing how a 1000cc Ducati WSBK can whoop up a bunch of 1000cc IL4 superbikes? My informed estimate is that the 850cc Duc will be a serious overdog when it comes to HP. This based upon Jeff Nash confiding a couple years ago to me that Ducati Corse had a race prepped 749R that was revving to 15K RPM, putting down 150 rwhp and doing it reliably "all day long", his exact words, at a test track in Germany. Whether the rider and team can capitalize on the HP advantage is entirely another issue. First year in a series on a new bike with a new team? Ask the folks at Hals, Dealy's, Warrs, and Hanover how that works out. Heck, ask the folks at Ilmor. You and I both know that it is rarely reasonable to expect a new team with a new bike who are new to the series to be competitive right out of the box. But we'll be cheering them on anyway!  I guess that's maybe what you were alluding to? Go Buell! Go Ducati! | ||
| Diablobrian |
Larry Pegram is a good racer, very competetive. It should be interesting to see how he does on the Ducs. | ||
| Jimidan |
Yes, Blake, that was amazing, but I have to really chalk that up to the rider, who also won the last leg of MotoGP after not competing in that series all year long. Bayless is really amazing...he was innazone all year long! The other WSBK Ducati bikes ridden by Lorenzo Lanzi and company didn't do so well, including the one that Curtis Roberts was piloting. However, as you mentioned, I was also alluding to it being a new FX bike right out of the box trying to compete with very well sorted out Hondas with 3+ years and the rest with at least 1 year of development. I have a great deal of respect of Jeff Nash, as I almost bought one of his 996's before I decided on my 998. I don't have quite the respect for Pegram, as I think he has lost his edge that it takes to run up front with those guys. We both know that having 150 HP on hand is no guarantee to success, or even breaking the top 6 bikes as the XBRR showed us. I believe that the Ducati will do better than the XBRR, simply because it is a racing machine with a racing motor already. But that mechanical advantage owned by the IL4's is so hard to beat...just look at the Ducati's results in the WSBK 600 Supersport class. Not very impressive, although they were not running 850 ccs, but they were not running against FX bikes either. But make no mistake about it, I WILL be cheering Larry and company on. I am a big Ducati fan. | ||
| Coolice |
If you would check out the moto-st.com website, all the bikes you are getting so excited about already raced. For 8 hours, and the 1 hour SPEED tv program is Dec 17th 3 pm est. Next year the participation should even stronger. | ||
| Blake |
Jimi, I think the World Supersport IL4's are very close to the AMA FX machines. I think JQ uncovered that interesting information not too long ago. | ||
| Trojan |
It isn't just the WSS IL4's that are close to AMA FX, so are the top AMA SUpersports bikes. I think DiSalvo/Bostrom/DuHamel could win FX on their Supersports bikes and nobody spectating would know the difference (which is part of the image problem FX has outside the US). You can guarantee one thing if Ducati get involved. It will be a serious full on mega-dollar contender straight from the start of the season with lots of factory support, or they won't bother at all. It is no secret that Ducati will shortly announce the new 848 to replace the 749, and that would slot into FX very well indeed  Yes I know it is a photoshop pic, but you get the idea  | ||
| Trojan |
The other WSBK Ducati bikes ridden by Lorenzo Lanzi and company didn't do so well, including the one that Curtis Roberts was piloting. You can't compare the Ducati F06 of Bayliss/Lanzi with any of the other WSB Ducatis, or with the AMA variants (The F06 that Hodgson used lacked the electronics package of the World/British superbike versions). There are only 8 F06 Ducatis in existence on the tracks and they are a different animal to all the rest, with much more advanced electronics etc. The only other similar bikes racing in national Superbikes were those of Leon Haslam/Greg Lavilla in BSB. They were on the pace all year and only beaten by the HRC works Honda by a very narrow margin. Lanzi was very disapointing in his first season on the works bike, but they seem to have faith in him long term. (Message edited by trojan on December 07, 2006) | ||
| Buellshyter |
As always, folks start to follow where Buell leads. Hasn't it been discussed in another thread that Buell won't be returning to FX in 07?? Sounds like we threw a party and didn't show up. | ||
| Vagelis46 |
I have to agree with Trojan for the factory Ducati bike. It is very different to the rest of the bikes competing in the world SBK and AMA. When Ruben Xaus tested the factory bike with traction control, he said it was WAY AHEAD from the bike he race last year at WSBK. The fact that Lanzi is still at the factory team has to do with him being Italian, and not his riding abilities. | ||
| Jimidan |
The factory Ducati bike that Bayliss and Lanzi were riding is also considerably more expensive than the IL4 competition...which is why Ducati is moving up in displacement. Even the AMA version costs considerably more than the IL4 competition, and lasts 1/3 as long, according to the Ducati mechanics I talked to at the last race. I had the pleasure to have attended the "Last Supper" at a local Italian restaurant in Manchester, OH, with the Ducati American team on Saturday night at Mid-Ohio. They had great stories, and were more than a bit pissed at the way the whole thing went down. They told me that these tweaked out v-twins are built for one race, and then are sent back to Italy to rebuild. On the contrary, the IL4's of Yosh are built to last 3 weekends of racing. Big difference in operation cost here, boss! Plus, these factory mechanics/pit manager claimed that they were forbidden to cheat by Ducati, while the IL4 boys were cheating all the time...and even getting caught with no penalty other than a $2000 fine. There was no publicity of the infraction or loss of points, unless they were caught doing the exact same thing again. The kicker here is that they rarely checked for the same thing twice during the season. They said it was almost comical because the Japanese teams would walk in and when told what system the AMA techs was going to look at, that they would just pull out the check book and ask how much the fine was, without even tearing it down. The inherent mechanical advantage for IL4's is a very real and expensive aspect that all v-twins including Ducati, have to contend with, and it still takes a guy like Bayliss to win with it. The worm ain't Bayless. Look how good McWilliams is and he was still running well behind the leaders in FX. If he had been on a Yammy Haul he probably would have won the whole thing...I am glad he was on the XBRR! jimidan | ||
| Blake |
I don't recall Ducati ever ditching success for an Italian rider. Lanzi has won at the world level. He'll be a contender if he ever earns the prime seat with the team. "I think DiSalvo/Bostrom/DuHamel could win FX on their Supersports bikes and nobody spectating would know the difference (which is part of the image problem FX has outside the US)." Matt, that may have been true in years past, but no more. Check the lap times. AMA FX poll and fast race lap time are right closer to Superstock 1000 than Supersport if I recall correctly. (Message edited by Blake on December 09, 2006) | ||
| Blake |
Check the Road Atlanta results where in qualifying Josh Hayes on his Erion/HRC Honda was a second and a half quicker than Jamie Hacking on his Supersport championship winning R6, and more than two seconds quicker on fast race lap time. | ||
| Trojan |
Road Atlanta may have been an abberation Blake, look at the whole season and the times are extremely close. At round 8, Mid Ohio the fastest race Supersport time by Chris Caylor (Who?) was 1.26.087 whereas the fastest FX race time was Eric Bostrom in 1.27.613. At VIR the difference betwen FX & SS was just 0.6 seconds and the best Supersport time would have been 4th quickest in FX. The differences in times can be explained by the fact that FX bikes are allowed to run slicks whereas the SS boys have to run treaded DOT legal tyres. If the top SS riders ran a set of slicks on their SS bikes they would be right up there at the top of the time sheets in FX. Jason DiSalvo even changed the forks on his FX bike from the Ohlins Superbike forks back to the stock (modified I'm sure) Yamaha items because he preferred them. |
