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Buell Motorcycle Forum » Buell RACING & More » Racing - Bonneville, Land Speed Records » 260 MPH on a Street Bike « Previous Next »

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Blake
Posted on Sunday, October 15, 2006 - 02:42 am:   Edit Post Delete Post View Post/Check IP Print Post    Move Post (Custodian/Admin Only) Ban Poster IP (Custodian/Admin only)

Stock wheelbase too. Very good read. If you aren't an MO subscriber, I recommend signing up. : )

http://www.motorcycle.com/mo/mccontrib/06_PB_Fast_Busa/index.motml

An excerpt:

quote:

On October 30, 2005, Rich Yancy's Suzuki Hayabusa tripped the timing lights on the monster mile in Maxton, North Carolina at 260.28863 MPH to become the fastest open-wheel motorcycle in history. Producing over 475 horsepower from the Mr. Turbo-assisted power plant at the rear wheel, the scariest part of the equation is that the bike runs a stock wheelbase, and is totally street legal. A fact I can attest to, having ridden the insane red beast on the quiet rural country roads outside Charlotte, North Carolina.


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Rocketman
Posted on Sunday, October 15, 2006 - 07:56 am:   Edit Post Delete Post View Post/Check IP Print Post    Move Post (Custodian/Admin Only) Ban Poster IP (Custodian/Admin only)

That's impressive, but so is this for a bone stock straight out of the crate production motorcycle running at Bonneville this year.

Rocket
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Blake
Posted on Sunday, October 15, 2006 - 12:54 pm:   Edit Post Delete Post View Post/Check IP Print Post    Move Post (Custodian/Admin Only) Ban Poster IP (Custodian/Admin only)

That is old news mate. Where you been? And really, while very much impressive in its own right, let's be perfectly honest here. I doubt that the F4-1000R record setting machine was "bone stock straight out of the crate" as you seem to imagine. It surely received a Superstock type treatment where cam timing is optimized for top end performance, final drive ratio is optimized, fuel/timing mapping is optimized, lower viscosity oil is used along with tolerances pushed to the looser side for reduced frictional losses, and tolerances shaved for increased compression ratio. Hardly "bone stock straight out of the crate" wouldn't you agree? All those mods would still allow it to run in the production class. If the bike were "bone stock straight out of the crate" then why did the team require the services of "Tuner Eraldo Ferracci of Fast By Ferracci Racing Products"?

It'll sure be great to see an MV Augusta join the fun in AMA Superstock and hopefully superbike in the near future.
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Rocketman
Posted on Sunday, October 15, 2006 - 01:34 pm:   Edit Post Delete Post View Post/Check IP Print Post    Move Post (Custodian/Admin Only) Ban Poster IP (Custodian/Admin only)

I know it's old news but still good news and a great leveler between 260mph from a 475hp turbo Busa, which is all I was getting at.

I read sometime ago somewhere else that the Bonneville MV was taken straight out of the crate and prepped for the salt but not in the way you imagine with tare downs and compressions optimized. Hell Blake, we're talking MV here where things are a little tighter engineered than John Deere.

Rocket
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Blake
Posted on Sunday, October 15, 2006 - 03:38 pm:   Edit Post Delete Post View Post/Check IP Print Post    Move Post (Custodian/Admin Only) Ban Poster IP (Custodian/Admin only)

You don't know John Deere if you imagine that their engineering is not among the very tightest/best in the world.

Why would the need the services of a top race bike tuner if the bike was "bone stock straight out of the crate"? You are typically not that naive.

What?! Are you in love with an Italian girl or something? joker
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Rocketman
Posted on Sunday, October 15, 2006 - 05:06 pm:   Edit Post Delete Post View Post/Check IP Print Post    Move Post (Custodian/Admin Only) Ban Poster IP (Custodian/Admin only)

He was there to add kudos. You aren't naive enough to think he got his hands dirty are you?

As for John Deere, insert JCB, Forden, Massey Ferguson, or plain old 'tractor'.

Italian chic? I wish

Rocket
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Madduck
Posted on Sunday, October 15, 2006 - 07:40 pm:   Edit Post Delete Post View Post/Check IP Print Post    Move Post (Custodian/Admin Only) Ban Poster IP (Custodian/Admin only)

Blake,

Friends who were there believe this bike was taken out of the crate and run at Bonneville. It is also a race version of the of the 1000cc F4 which it shares enough components with the standard F4 to run in production class, which is based on appearance, muffler outlet diameter and stock size throttle bodies. Sort of like a 999r would be the same as a 999. Expert tuner is needed to change any component that break in the middle of a large salt desert. Disassembling for verification after record in tech area would also be greatly assisted by having someone with real race experience, especially if you need to run it again later. I have seen records lost because the team didn't have anyone with the skills or tools to take the moter apart enough to verify for class.

The tech people try to find someone to help but they will not take your motor apart for you.
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Blake
Posted on Sunday, October 15, 2006 - 08:30 pm:   Edit Post Delete Post View Post/Check IP Print Post    Move Post (Custodian/Admin Only) Ban Poster IP (Custodian/Admin only)

Ah "race version", I see. That changes everything. It would have already had all the Superstock type mods then straight from the factory?

Thanks Paul for clarifying that. : )
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Madduck
Posted on Sunday, October 15, 2006 - 11:24 pm:   Edit Post Delete Post View Post/Check IP Print Post    Move Post (Custodian/Admin Only) Ban Poster IP (Custodian/Admin only)

It is also for "sale" to the general public as it did come with a vin number. Don't remember how you qualified to buy one tho?? Maybe a handful came into the US.
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Blake
Posted on Monday, October 16, 2006 - 01:05 am:   Edit Post Delete Post View Post/Check IP Print Post    Move Post (Custodian/Admin Only) Ban Poster IP (Custodian/Admin only)

Right, just like the Ducati "R" bikes. How much $$ for the F4-1000R I wonder?

How large of a production run is required to rate a "production" class land speed record? Hmmmm.
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Rocketman
Posted on Monday, October 16, 2006 - 06:27 am:   Edit Post Delete Post View Post/Check IP Print Post    Move Post (Custodian/Admin Only) Ban Poster IP (Custodian/Admin only)

Blake the MV F4 1000R is the slightly more speced up version of the F4 1000S. It shares exactly the same engine and ancillaries except the f.i is slightly altered as is the ecu mapping, offering approximately 4bhp above the S model. The enhancements above the S to R model are lighter wheels, different forks to accommodate radial front brakes (not present on the S model), and a strengthened clutch. There are cosmetic differences such as paint schemes. The R model is now sold in the UK as the standard model and the S model is no more once they're sold out. 14.200 buys you a single seat R which is what they sold the S for until they discounted it down to 12.200. An extra 300 buys you a dual seat.

The models you don't know of, but your comments are suggestive of, do exists. They are as follows.

F4 Tamburini
F4 Senna
F4 SPR
F4 Ago
F4 Mamba
F4 Corse

Some of these models have a variable length throttle body (amongst other mods), and have broke 200mph officially. The Mamba is a track only MV and costs about 40.000 here. The Tamburini and Ago are road legal limited editions - cost about 23.000 The Senna is a painted black F4 R and closest to the 'normal' production 'run of the mill' MV. Non of these were the production model used for the Bonneville speed record if we are to believe what we read, therefore the MV F4 1000R has become the standard showroom production model from 2006 on. That means, produced in their thousands rather than hundreds. You old cynic But thanks anyway. The brochures are on the way!

Rocket

edited for more info

(Message edited by rocketman on October 16, 2006)
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Blake
Posted on Monday, October 16, 2006 - 01:58 pm:   Edit Post Delete Post View Post/Check IP Print Post    Move Post (Custodian/Admin Only) Ban Poster IP (Custodian/Admin only)

"Some of these models have a variable length throttle body (amongst other mods), and have broke 200mph officially."

Cool. Thanks for the clarification. Why would any serious LSR effort not tune the bike for optimum performance? I think it is naive to think it was not, especially with a top racing tuner on the team.
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Rocketman
Posted on Monday, October 16, 2006 - 03:10 pm:   Edit Post Delete Post View Post/Check IP Print Post    Move Post (Custodian/Admin Only) Ban Poster IP (Custodian/Admin only)

Well tell you what. I've rang a few at my end to find out the score, so why don't you ring Fast at your end and ask them?

I don't doubt for a moment they tuned an out of the crate machine for optimum performance Blake. You had them remapping ecu's and shaving for compression and tuning to Superstock spec.

Rocket
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Moxnix
Posted on Monday, October 16, 2006 - 09:28 pm:   Edit Post Delete Post View Post/Check IP Print Post    Move Post (Custodian/Admin Only) Ban Poster IP (Custodian/Admin only)

"How large of a production run is required to rate a "production" class land speed record?"

500
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Madduck
Posted on Monday, October 16, 2006 - 11:30 pm:   Edit Post Delete Post View Post/Check IP Print Post    Move Post (Custodian/Admin Only) Ban Poster IP (Custodian/Admin only)

Production is more flexible than it seems. Buell XB12 would include all of the variations, X Ss S R. Total to equal 500. Throttle bodies and exhaust outlets need to be stock diameter. The race bike needs to look exactly like one of the "variations". XBRR would be illegal as it was made for racing and has no vin and is not street legal. If the XBRR bodywork was delivered on a street bike with a VIN, say 25 units or so you could run it as a production bike. There does need to be some possibility that it could be purchased. The most important rules in the "rulebook" are on page one:

"All regulations are subject to change without notice"

"Any interpretation or deviation from these rules is left to the discretion of the officials. Their decision is final."

"Although a participants vehicle meets all safety and technical regulations,the vehicle may not be allowed to compete due to environmental or course conditions or other considerations. All decisions by the Race Director and the Contest Board are final."

Keeping these in mind as you pleed your case is critical. Everyone out there wants you to run except some of your competitors. Keeping and holding a record is not just about going faster. My S2 was protested cause the cap on the carb was chrome and not black. No S2 came with a chrome cap there. Didn't "appear" stock. Mine actually did come that way but I couldn't "prove" it. Life goes on, we deal with it.
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Rocketman
Posted on Tuesday, October 17, 2006 - 06:49 pm:   Edit Post Delete Post View Post/Check IP Print Post    Move Post (Custodian/Admin Only) Ban Poster IP (Custodian/Admin only)

Well I got some stunning brochures from MV this morning.

Have you called Fast yet Blake?

Rocket
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Blake
Posted on Wednesday, October 18, 2006 - 04:06 am:   Edit Post Delete Post View Post/Check IP Print Post    Move Post (Custodian/Admin Only) Ban Poster IP (Custodian/Admin only)

No.
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Rocketman
Posted on Wednesday, October 18, 2006 - 04:57 am:   Edit Post Delete Post View Post/Check IP Print Post    Move Post (Custodian/Admin Only) Ban Poster IP (Custodian/Admin only)

Guess I'll call 'em foy ya then.

Rocket
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Blake
Posted on Wednesday, October 18, 2006 - 09:54 am:   Edit Post Delete Post View Post/Check IP Print Post    Move Post (Custodian/Admin Only) Ban Poster IP (Custodian/Admin only)

They won't be able to understand you.
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Davegess
Posted on Wednesday, October 18, 2006 - 12:41 pm:   Edit Post Delete Post View Post/Check IP Print Post    Move Post (Custodian/Admin Only) Ban Poster IP (Custodian/Admin only)

One of the odd SCTA rules is the "stock appearing" rule. If you can prove that anything LOOKS the way it did from the factory you can do a ton of mods to the inside of it. IE a carb, the boby must be what the production vehicle came with but the jets and the like can be anything. I would think an ECU would be like that.

Of course I have not read the rule book and know nothing.

Also Mad is correct, the officials on the ground have a lot of leeway, they do want you to run. To see just how much leeway they have try to show up with a completely legal bike and run against Burt Munro's record. I am thinking you would not pass tech inspection.
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Blake
Posted on Thursday, November 30, 2006 - 02:03 pm:   Edit Post Delete Post View Post/Check IP Print Post    Move Post (Custodian/Admin Only) Ban Poster IP (Custodian/Admin only)

Sean,

You hear back from FBF yet? : )
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Rocketman
Posted on Thursday, November 30, 2006 - 02:44 pm:   Edit Post Delete Post View Post/Check IP Print Post    Move Post (Custodian/Admin Only) Ban Poster IP (Custodian/Admin only)

Do you have their phone number Blake

Rocket
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Court
Posted on Thursday, November 30, 2006 - 10:25 pm:   Edit Post Delete Post View Post/Check IP Print Post    Move Post (Custodian/Admin Only) Ban Poster IP (Custodian/Admin only)

Enraldo Ferracci
Willow Grove, PA
(215) 657-1267


Could be outdated, haven't been there in a while.
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Blake
Posted on Thursday, November 30, 2006 - 11:39 pm:   Edit Post Delete Post View Post/Check IP Print Post    Move Post (Custodian/Admin Only) Ban Poster IP (Custodian/Admin only)

Court,

You never cease to amaze. : )



Rocket,

http://www.ferracci.com/contact.php

Looks like he's in the book too.
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Xb9ser
Posted on Wednesday, July 04, 2007 - 09:25 pm:   Edit Post Delete Post View Post/Check IP Print Post    Move Post (Custodian/Admin Only) Ban Poster IP (Custodian/Admin only)

I have seen rich yancys bike run a lot of times as I live 2 hr from maxton. He is a fabracater for DEI. it is painted like JRs car.First time i saw it run was 2001 and it ran 232, every year it seems to go faster. He does ride it on street said he couldn't aford a race bike and a street bike.he races it some but for record runs someone else rides it. Rich is about 7ft tall and not as airodanamic.I beleive it is Lee Sheets from Charlotte NC.He is a well known engine builder who used to street race a 600 gsxer with a busa engine.
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