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Electraglider_1997
Posted on Friday, August 25, 2017 - 10:38 am:   Edit Post Delete Post View Post/Check IP Print Post    Move Post (Custodian/Admin Only) Ban Poster IP (Custodian/Admin only)

I know a lot of you guys have a problem with Harley but their 2018 bikes, the big twins, are really looking nice. I'd like to have that Fatbob with the 114 cubic inch engine. Heck I wouldn't mind having most anyone of them. Harley sure knows how to lay on the paint and those engines are jewels.
https://motorcycles.harley-davidson.com/us/en/moto rcycles/2018/softail/fat-bob.html
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Hugie03flhr
Posted on Friday, August 25, 2017 - 11:48 am:   Edit Post Delete Post View Post/Check IP Print Post    Move Post (Custodian/Admin Only) Ban Poster IP (Custodian/Admin only)

I'm tempted to trade in my roadking for a new one but they have gotten so damn heavy in the last 8 years! The power is nice but moving around in a rock parking lot is a workout.
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Electraglider_1997
Posted on Friday, August 25, 2017 - 12:31 pm:   Edit Post Delete Post View Post/Check IP Print Post    Move Post (Custodian/Admin Only) Ban Poster IP (Custodian/Admin only)

They should do whatever it takes to drop their big twins down a couple hundred pounds each. They did drop 35 lbs by redesigning their soft tail swingarms by going from 2 shocks to only one. And they point out that weight loss so they know people would like these bikes to lose weight. My wife rides a Sportster and it is too heavy for her by at least 100 lbs. They'd sell to more women if they could drop some weight all across their models. Nobody wants to pick an 800 lb bike off the ground and the heavier the bike is the more parts are damaged in a tip over. I test rode a Triumph Rocket 3 once and the shear mass of that bike was what put me off. It was faster than hell but I felt like I was riding a Rocket instead of a motorcycle so they named it appropriately. I didn't feel safe on it and I am not a short or little guy.
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Tootal
Posted on Monday, August 28, 2017 - 09:26 am:   Edit Post Delete Post View Post/Check IP Print Post    Move Post (Custodian/Admin Only) Ban Poster IP (Custodian/Admin only)

The new engine still uses the same junk crank and compensator nut. If you're going to redo your engine lets fix the old problems first! Get rid of chain drive primary's and put a gear in there. Victory got that one right! With out of round and improperly balanced cranks I have no desire to pay good money for something with such a lousy foundation.

I sat on an Indian Springfield yesterday. With a taller seat...
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Hughlysses
Posted on Monday, August 28, 2017 - 10:00 am:   Edit Post Delete Post View Post/Check IP Print Post    Move Post (Custodian/Admin Only) Ban Poster IP (Custodian/Admin only)

I'm surprised they haven't reworked the bottom end of the big twins in all this time. They could go to a one-piece forged crank, keep the knife-and-fork rods, but use a high pressure lube system and bearing inserts instead of needle bearings.

It must add a huge cost to the engine to have to assemble the 2 piece cranks. It's apparently hard enough to assemble one correctly on a work bench; I'm sure it's a royal bitch to do hundreds of them on an assembly line.

There's a long thread on the 2018's at ADVrider. Interesting side discussion on whether the Sportster will get similar updates next year or if the Sportster goes away in favor of the newish small water cooled bikes. I hope they upgrade it.
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Natexlh1000
Posted on Monday, August 28, 2017 - 10:20 am:   Edit Post Delete Post View Post/Check IP Print Post    Move Post (Custodian/Admin Only) Ban Poster IP (Custodian/Admin only)

If they had chosen to use Erik Buell's uniplaner engine mounting system, they could have made the sportster lighter instead of 75 pounds heavier.
Sporsters weight as much as goldwings used to.

That's just plain dumb.
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Electraglider_1997
Posted on Monday, August 28, 2017 - 05:04 pm:   Edit Post Delete Post View Post/Check IP Print Post    Move Post (Custodian/Admin Only) Ban Poster IP (Custodian/Admin only)

I went to two HD dealers and one had 4 2018 softails and the other had a Road King Special which was all black chrome. The 2018 Fatbob with the 114 cu inch engine is pretty darned nice looking and fits me like a glove. That Road King Special is an absolutely beautiful bike with a very comfortable seat. I would take either or both. They should go to a monoshock on their touring bikes also. I think they have hit a home run with the new bikes. Don't see why anyone would opt for the 107 when they can get the 114 engine on many of the new models.
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Oddball
Posted on Monday, August 28, 2017 - 09:16 pm:   Edit Post Delete Post View Post/Check IP Print Post    Move Post (Custodian/Admin Only) Ban Poster IP (Custodian/Admin only)

Maybe they could shrink the FXR chassis for a sportster engine and make it in titanium? Maybe a project for Big Bear Choppers?

Or get them to make a titanium version of the new softail frame to drop some weight. Forged or carbon rims and a primary and clutch that don't stick out a mile and a half. Raise the bike higher so it gains cornering clearance and room to properly tuck the exhaust under the bike where it belongs. Fully adjustable suspension front and rear.

My nephew is quite upset. He really liked the Lowrider S. Now he's talking about an R6. LOL teenagers....
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Phelan
Posted on Monday, August 28, 2017 - 10:04 pm:   Edit Post Delete Post View Post/Check IP Print Post    Move Post (Custodian/Admin Only) Ban Poster IP (Custodian/Admin only)

Hugh you can't install knife and fork rods on a one piece forged crank. The HD crank is plenty strong in most scenarios for what they are doing with it. 2007 is the main year they had issues as HE had issues with rod bearings across the board that year. As with the primary, it's not the best setup but it works, often for hundreds of thousands of miles. And the primary sides are 2" more inboard than the Twin Cams, as they heavily reworked this area in the M8 motors to narrow and move the primary for more clearance.
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Hughlysses
Posted on Monday, August 28, 2017 - 11:19 pm:   Edit Post Delete Post View Post/Check IP Print Post    Move Post (Custodian/Admin Only) Ban Poster IP (Custodian/Admin only)

^ I believe you could, although the fabrication required might be difficult and therefore cost prohibitive. The "knife" rod would have a separate cap like rods in most engines. The fork rod would have two smaller caps. It might be tricky to provide sufficient room for the bolts, which might necessitate a wider crank pin. Obviously it's much easier to slightly offset the cylinders and provide two conventional rods.

Another approach that would keep the cylinders in line and allow the use of bearing inserts is to have a master rod and a slave rod, similar to the arrangement in radial engines. I've seen pics of a monster Australian motorcycle v-twin that used this setup.

I'm sure the existing crank setup is plenty strong, it's just that a crank with a press fit requiring precise alignment in 3 planes seems crazy complex and archaic to me.

(Message edited by Hughlysses on August 28, 2017)
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Electraglider_1997
Posted on Tuesday, August 29, 2017 - 10:51 am:   Edit Post Delete Post View Post/Check IP Print Post    Move Post (Custodian/Admin Only) Ban Poster IP (Custodian/Admin only)

Oddball,
After getting a closeup look at the 2018 Harleys I'm hoping that a new sportster will be a variation of the new Softail monoshock frame. They get rid of the oil tank and do the same counter balancer as they are doing with the softail bikes. And provide a decent suspension with adjust-ability so every bump doesn't wreck the spine. Hopefully they can get 20+ hp improvement and give the bike at least a 4.5 gallon gas tank. That is where Harley f'd up in my opinion on 1/2 of the new softail bikes the gas tanks are only 3.6 gallons. The Fat Boy and a couple of others do have a 5 gallon tank and that is ok. Electric vehicles for the most part give you range anxiety but a motorcycle with a gas tank should not.

(Message edited by electraglider_1997 on August 29, 2017)
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Hughlysses
Posted on Tuesday, August 29, 2017 - 11:14 am:   Edit Post Delete Post View Post/Check IP Print Post    Move Post (Custodian/Admin Only) Ban Poster IP (Custodian/Admin only)

Where the Sportster (and the newish Street 500 and 750) really need help is in the weight loss department. It's insane that a Sportster weighs ~100 pounds more than an XB12. That's a good 20% more.

Supposedly before they introduced the rubber mount Sportsters, they also had prototype Sportsters with rigidly mounted engines with balance shafts, so the designs likely exist if they wanted to use them.
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Oddball
Posted on Tuesday, August 29, 2017 - 12:03 pm:   Edit Post Delete Post View Post/Check IP Print Post    Move Post (Custodian/Admin Only) Ban Poster IP (Custodian/Admin only)

In the tradition of engine naming (knuckle head, pan head) they should have named it the "lump head".

Lead engineer Pete Puma wanted "a whole lotta lumps".


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Natexlh1000
Posted on Tuesday, August 29, 2017 - 12:13 pm:   Edit Post Delete Post View Post/Check IP Print Post    Move Post (Custodian/Admin Only) Ban Poster IP (Custodian/Admin only)

Lead engineer:

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