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Hangetsu
Posted on Tuesday, August 08, 2017 - 12:21 am:   Edit Post Delete Post View Post/Check IP Print Post    Move Post (Custodian/Admin Only) Ban Poster IP (Custodian/Admin only)

So just when I thought all I had to do to bring my poor beast back to fighting health was replace rocker-box cover gaskets, what ever else should be replaced after one goes through the trouble of rotating the engine, and give it a thorough degreacing, this happens.

Anyone ever see a leak like this one before? The discharge is too thin for Amsoil 20/50, does not smell like gas, and is gray and creamy like a thin liquid graphite.

I thought of water mixed with oil, but I've changed the primary fluid twice since the last rain. I've peaked around in the general area, but the entire area around the rear of the primary case is pretty saturated, around the swingarm pivot as well. Oil level in the tank is maintaining a good level, so I don't think it's crank oil.

Any opinions?






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Etennuly
Posted on Tuesday, August 08, 2017 - 05:47 am:   Edit Post Delete Post View Post/Check IP Print Post    Move Post (Custodian/Admin Only) Ban Poster IP (Custodian/Admin only)

Battery acid.
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Natexlh1000
Posted on Tuesday, August 08, 2017 - 09:50 am:   Edit Post Delete Post View Post/Check IP Print Post    Move Post (Custodian/Admin Only) Ban Poster IP (Custodian/Admin only)

Battery acid looks like water and leaves white crystals behind that looks like salt.

That location in on the other side of where the tranny breather is.
Also, a starter gasket failure could leave a nice mess there.

On another track, it could be leaking engine oil from above.


Your first step is cleaning it off and getting a good look with strong light.
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Tootal
Posted on Tuesday, August 08, 2017 - 10:14 am:   Edit Post Delete Post View Post/Check IP Print Post    Move Post (Custodian/Admin Only) Ban Poster IP (Custodian/Admin only)

It looks like a hose is laying on top of the cases, right where it's coming from. If that is a hose, trace it to your problem. I'm with Vern, it looks like battery acid. What battery are you using?
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Hangetsu
Posted on Tuesday, August 08, 2017 - 10:55 am:   Edit Post Delete Post View Post/Check IP Print Post    Move Post (Custodian/Admin Only) Ban Poster IP (Custodian/Admin only)

Hmm, unless my Shorai has suddenly liquified, I'm going to rule out battery acid. Starter gasket failure seems like a good possibility, but I guess cleaning the area to get a better look should be the next step.

Thanks for the input, and any other ideas will be welcome.

Cheers!

A-
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Teeps
Posted on Tuesday, August 08, 2017 - 11:47 am:   Edit Post Delete Post View Post/Check IP Print Post    Move Post (Custodian/Admin Only) Ban Poster IP (Custodian/Admin only)

Transmission vent hose was dislodged from the nipple during previous work?
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Electraglider_1997
Posted on Tuesday, August 08, 2017 - 12:16 pm:   Edit Post Delete Post View Post/Check IP Print Post    Move Post (Custodian/Admin Only) Ban Poster IP (Custodian/Admin only)

Lite a match to it and if you and your bike go up in a mushroom cloud you'll know it WAS your gas tank leaking.
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Hangetsu
Posted on Tuesday, August 08, 2017 - 01:14 pm:   Edit Post Delete Post View Post/Check IP Print Post    Move Post (Custodian/Admin Only) Ban Poster IP (Custodian/Admin only)

Not a bad ideal on the match.
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Natexlh1000
Posted on Tuesday, August 08, 2017 - 01:47 pm:   Edit Post Delete Post View Post/Check IP Print Post    Move Post (Custodian/Admin Only) Ban Poster IP (Custodian/Admin only)

Yes and future repairs are more simple.
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Hugie03flhr
Posted on Tuesday, August 08, 2017 - 02:04 pm:   Edit Post Delete Post View Post/Check IP Print Post    Move Post (Custodian/Admin Only) Ban Poster IP (Custodian/Admin only)

I'll go with battery acid also. I never seen oil discolor cases like that.
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Natexlh1000
Posted on Tuesday, August 08, 2017 - 02:40 pm:   Edit Post Delete Post View Post/Check IP Print Post    Move Post (Custodian/Admin Only) Ban Poster IP (Custodian/Admin only)

He has a lithinum battery so I have no idea what color "blood" it has.
I don't think the stock AGM batteries would leak if you cut them in half.
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Teeps
Posted on Tuesday, August 08, 2017 - 03:03 pm:   Edit Post Delete Post View Post/Check IP Print Post    Move Post (Custodian/Admin Only) Ban Poster IP (Custodian/Admin only)

Natexlh1000 Posted on Tuesday, August 08, 2017
He has a lithinum battery so I have no idea what color "blood" it has.
I don't think the stock AGM batteries would leak if you cut them in half.


Not sure about if cut in half.
But, I can say from experience that drilling a 1/8" hole in the side, near the bottom, did not produce a leak in a Yuasa AGM battery.
I sealed the hole with JB-Weld and it lasted for another 5 years, give or take.}
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Tootal
Posted on Tuesday, August 08, 2017 - 06:51 pm:   Edit Post Delete Post View Post/Check IP Print Post    Move Post (Custodian/Admin Only) Ban Poster IP (Custodian/Admin only)

I thought maybe he bought the wrong type of battery, not the first time someone has done that but obviously that's not it.

Has the breather reroute been done on this bike? Is that breather spooge?
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Etennuly
Posted on Tuesday, August 08, 2017 - 07:29 pm:   Edit Post Delete Post View Post/Check IP Print Post    Move Post (Custodian/Admin Only) Ban Poster IP (Custodian/Admin only)

Well near that location you also have rear shock oil. Possibly rear brake fluid.
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Hangetsu
Posted on Wednesday, August 09, 2017 - 02:31 am:   Edit Post Delete Post View Post/Check IP Print Post    Move Post (Custodian/Admin Only) Ban Poster IP (Custodian/Admin only)

On the past few comments:

I have a Shorai Lith Ion battery - no liquid inside.

Nope, I have not done the breather reroute. Hoses go directly from the rocker covers to the air box. Besides, they're far too far forward for any splooge to reach this area.

This liquid has almost the consistency of water. It's thin, not slippery, and there's no odor. But it doesn't seem to dry either. The strange thing is, the fluid running down the side of my case is graphite grey and somewhat creamy, almost like water mixed with oil. However, After the rains finally stopped this year, I changed the primary & trany oil. It was pretty milky form a winter of riding in torrential rain, so changed the oil, rode a couple of weeks with the fresh oil, then changed it again. The oil from the first change was still pretty clean, even after a couple of weeks of riding. Therefore, I can't imagine there being any water in the primary system now, especially since it hasn't rained since then. There seems to be no obvious explanation for where this fluid could be coming from. I will dig deeper this weekend when I have a little more time.
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Desert_bird
Posted on Wednesday, August 09, 2017 - 06:39 am:   Edit Post Delete Post View Post/Check IP Print Post    Move Post (Custodian/Admin Only) Ban Poster IP (Custodian/Admin only)

I'm betting on a leaky starter gasket or tranny breather hose.
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Hangetsu
Posted on Wednesday, August 09, 2017 - 09:15 pm:   Edit Post Delete Post View Post/Check IP Print Post    Move Post (Custodian/Admin Only) Ban Poster IP (Custodian/Admin only)

I will put my hopes on the breather tube. Even if it's a bear to fix, it doesn;t sound like something that can lead to future consequences if I let it go for a while. I don't even want to think if the ordeal involved with changing the starter gasket.

Thanks for all your comments.

A-
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Ourdee
Posted on Wednesday, August 09, 2017 - 11:07 pm:   Edit Post Delete Post View Post/Check IP Print Post    Move Post (Custodian/Admin Only) Ban Poster IP (Custodian/Admin only)

Splooge? Are the hoses hooked back up on top?
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Griffmeister
Posted on Thursday, August 10, 2017 - 12:17 am:   Edit Post Delete Post View Post/Check IP Print Post    Move Post (Custodian/Admin Only) Ban Poster IP (Custodian/Admin only)

That is a tough area to try to examine. I think it might be worthwhile to remove the belt cover and the air box base and peek around with a really bright light. With those two removed you can see the whole top of the tranny/starter area as well as the rear head. Still, the lack of odor, strange consistency and odd location stands out. I might agree with Etennuly on shock oil since that is right under the preload adjuster. Could just be picking up dirt and crap from the previous leak before it becomes visible on the side cover.
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Hangetsu
Posted on Thursday, August 10, 2017 - 01:52 am:   Edit Post Delete Post View Post/Check IP Print Post    Move Post (Custodian/Admin Only) Ban Poster IP (Custodian/Admin only)

Hmm, Shock oil. Interesting thought. I'll check into it. It is weird how it drips across the top or the primary and down the face. It seems, if the starter gasket were leaking, the mess would be mostly on the inside case, tranny, etc. Seems unlikely that it would flow up and over. Something above dripping down over the top of the case makes much more sense.
I'll just have to wait two weekends or so till I have the time to tear it apart.

Cheers!

A-
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Rdkingryder
Posted on Tuesday, August 15, 2017 - 10:45 pm:   Edit Post Delete Post View Post/Check IP Print Post    Move Post (Custodian/Admin Only) Ban Poster IP (Custodian/Admin only)

Try washing it all down with Brakekleen spray Dessenex at the suspected areas and take it for a ride. That should help locate where it's coming from.
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Ourdee
Posted on Tuesday, August 15, 2017 - 10:54 pm:   Edit Post Delete Post View Post/Check IP Print Post    Move Post (Custodian/Admin Only) Ban Poster IP (Custodian/Admin only)

Do the wash and Dessenex without the ride. Just put the kick stand up and play rocking horse to work the rear suspension. No spot yet, try adjusting the preload up and down a few times. Then look again.
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Ourdee
Posted on Tuesday, August 15, 2017 - 10:58 pm:   Edit Post Delete Post View Post/Check IP Print Post    Move Post (Custodian/Admin Only) Ban Poster IP (Custodian/Admin only)

If I remember right (big if), there was a crush washer of some kind on the preload unit on my XT that would leak if you disassembled it and didn't put a new one in when you put it back together.
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Etennuly
Posted on Wednesday, August 16, 2017 - 05:55 am:   Edit Post Delete Post View Post/Check IP Print Post    Move Post (Custodian/Admin Only) Ban Poster IP (Custodian/Admin only)

Do not use brake cleaner. It will melt the powder coat.
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Ratbuell
Posted on Wednesday, August 16, 2017 - 08:01 am:   Edit Post Delete Post View Post/Check IP Print Post    Move Post (Custodian/Admin Only) Ban Poster IP (Custodian/Admin only)

Short rides will put moisture in your oils due to temperature changes. If you don't get the fluids hot enough to burn off condensation you get milkshake. It doesn't have to rain.
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Hangetsu
Posted on Wednesday, August 16, 2017 - 09:20 pm:   Edit Post Delete Post View Post/Check IP Print Post    Move Post (Custodian/Admin Only) Ban Poster IP (Custodian/Admin only)

I've had the milkshake thing during the winter, both here and in Colorado, but I have never experienced it during the summer months - especially when daytime temperatures average in the 80's - 100's. And the temperatures here have been in that range during the past two months since I last changed the fluids. I will check the dipstick and primary covers, but I'm guessing the oil's pretty clean.

I am now leaning toward the starter gasket theory. I wiped the whole area down a few days ago, and within a few rides, a thin layer of seepage was coming up over the cases directly in the area surrounding the starter. The started seems to be the culprit - which doesn't make me very happy.

I checked around the shock and preload adjuster - totally clean all the way around.

Thanks for the ideas.

A-
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Rdkingryder
Posted on Wednesday, August 16, 2017 - 09:42 pm:   Edit Post Delete Post View Post/Check IP Print Post    Move Post (Custodian/Admin Only) Ban Poster IP (Custodian/Admin only)

Isn't the transmission breather hose routed past the starter? Did you ride in any heavy downpours or creek crossings? Looks like a water mix in there.
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Hangetsu
Posted on Saturday, August 19, 2017 - 03:06 am:   Edit Post Delete Post View Post/Check IP Print Post    Move Post (Custodian/Admin Only) Ban Poster IP (Custodian/Admin only)

Downpours, yes, but not since early May, and I've changed the primary fluid twice since then.
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Hughlysses
Posted on Saturday, August 19, 2017 - 07:55 am:   Edit Post Delete Post View Post/Check IP Print Post    Move Post (Custodian/Admin Only) Ban Poster IP (Custodian/Admin only)

I just replaced my starter gasket this week. Mine had been leaking for a couple of years, but until recently only enough to keep the area below the starter dirty. After 2 weeks of riding in the mountains recently, it was beginning to accumulate and drip onto the muffler.

It does seem weird that your leak "climbed" up and over the primary case. If it's the starter gasket, it will definitely show on top the engine. Get a flashlight and look on the right side of the engine below the starter on top of the engine case; it will show if it's leaking there.
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Hangetsu
Posted on Sunday, August 20, 2017 - 10:49 am:   Edit Post Delete Post View Post/Check IP Print Post    Move Post (Custodian/Admin Only) Ban Poster IP (Custodian/Admin only)

That will be my afternoon project.
Thanks.
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