| Author | Message | ||
     Woodnbow |
OK, we all know our Uly days are numbered... We all, well most of us, love our Uly's for a variety of reasons but there will come a day when something else will take the place of our Uly's for daily driving. That's my question, I've been looking at Stelvio, Multistrada, GS, GSA, and a few bikes more into the sport touring segment, Norge, to name the most likely candidate. The problem is that I'm spoiled by Mr. Buells successes with the Uly. Nothing I've ridden has such a supple responsive real world suspension. I think the low unsprung weight combined with good geometry and fully adjustable long travel suspension is responsible for that brilliant Uly ride quality. Similarly, the engine/transmission are just excellent for backcountry exploration and canyon carving. Sure, Ducati's will make Uly seem positively asthmatic but from 2000-6000 rpm this motor/transmission really shines. The bike is comfortable for long days in the saddle, sporty enough to satisfy all but the ricky racer types and economical to boot. What on earth am I going to replace it with when that sad day comes? Ideas anyone?? | ||
| Sagehawk |
This would be a total grasshopper moment! Do like dr. Greg and hang to see what ebr offers in 2 or 3 years from now. I know I'm looking for smaller n lighter cuz wrestling a big bike is slowly becoming something I don't want. Most of us uly folk are mid 50's plus and picking those things up are no longer fun. Like setting clearance on a set of timken wheel bearing. Anyhow, a DR suzuki with a 790 kit, a husky 701 enduro is starting to become a appealing option. Certainly around 12000 bucks would be max I would want to spend. I do know when wife and I get out on sporster and buell, the 1200's are almost too large for no more than we ride and at the speeds we ride. Anyway, it's all about choices and since I do all my own work I need simple. Enough of what I'm looking for. I do know when I'm gone, my wife or kid will have to decide to keep or get rid of uellymae. Enuff said! | ||
| Etennuly |
 well stated and totally accurate from where i sit. I'd like to see a Uly with a niner engine and a two inch lower seat with the same suspension. | ||
| Mark_weiss |
The magic is in the Ulysses' suspension. Have you noticed that there never really was much of an aftermarket for XB suspension parts? Quite different from everything else. (Message edited by Mark_weiss on March 05, 2016) | ||
| Trevd |
I agree. The suspension is the strongest part of the Uly... Every other bike I've ridden since buying the Ulysses - not that I've ridden that many - has left me wanting in the suspension dept. I'm sure the ones with the on-the-fly auto-adjustable electronic suspension might be better, but I haven't tried any yet. | ||
| Hughlysses |
Clearly, someone needs to start a business refurbishing Ulys to like-new condition, with a few upgrades of course. We can keep them running forever! | ||
| Glenn |
I also have a 2012 VStrom 650 adventure which I put a fork brace and Ricor Intiminators in. Its not bad. I have ridden my friend's Multistrada on a few occasions for a couple hundred miles all together. It is very close to the Uly with more power. His has the Olhins upgrade. It would be my replacement choice for the Uly, however cost and maintenance are high. | ||
| Mark_weiss |
I've ridden a few BMWs with electronic suspension. They are not better. With about $3k of aftermarket parts, they are close though. | ||
| Panhead_dan |
This chapter in motorcycledom is about over people. There will never be a bike even close to what our Ulysses are. Even when they were in production, the closest comparable bike was at least 50 lbs heavier. V Strom DL 1000 was fairly close at an even 100 lbs more. There will soon be highways 100% covered in self driving vehicles only. Much like the airlines have been for a decade now. These vehicles will have 4 wheels. At the ever steeper rate of advancement, it's going to be here much sooner than we think. I would really love to be wrong. | ||
| Teeps |
Many ULY truisms in this thread. There is literally NO bike, currently, available that can match the Ulysses tit for tat, and come out ahead in my book. | ||
| Mark_weiss |
The Tiger 800 is remarkably close | ||
| Woodnbow |
I think the Stelvio engine would come close to emulating the Ulysses power delivery but the bike itself is nearly 100# heavier. I'm a big guy and strong, 500# motorcycles aren't a problem for me but lighter is better within reason... The Ducati makes a lot of power and the weight is right as is the suspension. But then we're looking at either high dollar maintenance or pain in the butt maintenance and a rather steep cost on the front end. GS? Nah, that bike does nothing for me. Doesn't handle as well as the Uly IMO and the motor is kinda, meh... bland... I've looked at the Super Tenere too, what a beast that is! I mean it is YuuUUUge as The Donald would say.. and again with the complexities and cost of maintenance. No thanks. I like the uneven firing pulses of 45 degree Vtwins. It's all I've owned in the last 35 years. To me the quintessential sound and feel of a motorcycle. Well, I am rebuilding the transmission on my 08 so I bought a new (1000 miles) 09 engine/trans to transplant into Uly for the summer while I rebuild the transmission and bore the cases for the 88" Mountain Motor.. That ought to keep me motoring along for the next 5 years. Maybe by then Erik will have the next Uly up and running. | ||
| Ourdee |
Right now, there is no bike to beat it and that is before you figure price point. | ||
| Teeps |
Mark_weiss Posted on Saturday, March 05, 2016 - The Tiger 800 is remarkably close Yes except: 15k or more for a base model. (no cruise control, which is one rider aid I would like.) Chain to maintain Valves that need adjusting Water cooling Inferior suspension, compared to Uly. 19" front wheel 60" wheel base! ABS & Traction control don't want or need either. Ride by wire don't want it I don't believe the stated weight or MPG listed in the specs. Even at greatly reduced price i.e. buying low mileage used, doesn't change any of the exceptions. Hard to replace the Ulysses... Ourdee Posted on Saturday, March 05, 2016 - Right now, there is no bike to beat it and that is before you figure price point. To quote Lynyrd Skynyrd "You got that right! Sure got that right!" (Message edited by teeps on March 05, 2016) | ||
| Etennuly |
Damn you Erik Buell!! Look what you did to all of these good people! You have literally ruined them for life.....I hope you are happy.  | ||
| Mark_weiss |
I spent one day on a Tiger 800. It carries its weight well. If the Tiger outweighs the Uly, it is not by much. Ride and handling was very good. Surprisingly so for a stock bike. I did not have to maintain the bike, so those points were not a worry. No one seems to want ABS, until that time when they actually need it. | ||
| Ratbuell |
So find a new bike with similar fork diameters and rear shock/spring mounting and dimensions. Put your Uly suspension on your brandX bike. Or....just keep your Uly on the road with the massive aftermarket maintenance support. It's a 1200 Evo motor - gaskets are out there, hard parts can be found or made, and just about anything besides a frame can be found/retrofitted/substituted with something "mainstream". Witness the Shindengan voltage regulator conversions that are getting more frequent, as an example. I'm just gonna keep riding the damn thing. | ||
| Ourdee |
I told Erik once that the Uly was the best bike I'd ever rode. It may stay that way. | ||
| Panhead_dan |
"No one seems to want ABS, until that time when they actually need it." If I used up 58 bikes without needing it, it's likely I never will. You are either brainwashed, a newish rider or both. The only thing these "rider aids" are capable of doing is removing rider input. They can only decrease your control inputs. At no time will they EVER increase anything except the ability of a new rider to operate the bike. This is not safe. The new rider needs to learn how to operate the bike on his own in order to stay alive. | ||
| Reepicheep |
I may not choose the cost, weight or complexity of ABS, and I may want to be able to tune the ABS so that I can still stoppie in an emergency, and I may not want bad ABS... But a really well done ABS system for the front wheel of your motorcycle is nothing but win. I'm curious Panhead... under what circumstance do you think it will help you to lock up the front wheel of your motorcycle? | ||
| Panhead_dan |
The level of control learned by NOT locking up the wheel is key. The device removes that. Learn to ride without rider aids and be a much better rider. Ride a bike without the device and enjoy lighter weight, better handling, less complexity and expense. | ||
| Uly_man |
I am 100% with Ratbuell and Panhead dans posts. This bike does have some problems but they are not faults. More like niggling issues from product development and the quality of some of its "outsourced" parts. I have had both the first and last versions of this bike and the 10 bike is the best. The engines control being its main strength. The combination of this, even on a 06 bike, the frame design and the amazing quality of the suspension system makes for a bike that is a sheer joy to ride on the road. Setup the bike right and look after it and I see no reason why you could not get many years and miles out of it. | ||
| Mark_weiss |
"Used up 58 motorcycles", wow, you are a real expert. My Ulysses is only number 8 for me. That clearly means that I don't ride very much. You seem to have also thoroughly investigated ABS and fully understand the systems. I did not know that there were road riding incidents where the ability to skid while trying to stop would be useful. Clearly, I stand corrected. | ||
| Ourdee |
Mark, To be fair, when ABS is used on Ice it increases braking distance because the grit collected in front of the tire is allowed to escape every time the ABS lets the tire roll over it. I have had the Electronic Stability Program (ESP) in my car maneuver around a potential collision that I do not think I would have escaped on my own. The program also includes Traction Control System (TCS), Electronic Roll Mitigation (ERM), Brake Assist System (BAS) and Anti-lock Brake System (ABS). My perception was it acted like it was operating cutter brakes to control the yawl. I wouldn't mind a good traction control system. Last I thought I heard there was about a $200,000.00 difference between street and race systems that were good on motorcycles. | ||
| Falloutnl |
"The level of control learned by NOT locking up the wheel is key. The device removes that." Yeah, that's nice, but ultimately irrelevant when ABS is a good as it is. Obviously there's situations where ABS is not going to help you (off road), but for 99% of the time it's better than what a human can do and I would have it on my Buells if I could. | ||
| Etennuly |
I was involved in a paved surface motorcycle wreck one time. The wreck of two other bikes happened in front of me. Directly so. In order to avoid running over the rider in front of me I had to turn the wrong way mid corner, lock the brakes front and rear to intentionally lay the bike down so that it would slide off the corner in the same direction that his bike was sliding. I don't believe I would have had the mental or physical resources left in those split seconds to override an ABS system. I had to make the "human induced" deliberate crash move to avoid excess personal injury to a rider who was beginning to slide directly into my highly committed track path. I don't want ABS. I learned to drive on snow and ice as a kid. My first ten years of driving involved a lot of sideways control on different surfaces, slippery or not. This kind of control and commitment to a move is not unlike learning to find the balance point while riding a wheelie on a bike. This winter my ABS in my Tahoe took over several times on icy roads. It did not help me control or stop my vehicle. It was more like I had to wait for it to finish doing it's stuff so that I could use my natural reactions for control. It even gets in the way of fun stuff driving. Most of the folks I know who can pull the front tire in the air and shift gears can relate to how I feel about ABS systems. Most of the folks I know who cannot do a wheelie I believe could benefit from ABS. It is not for everybody. Those new computer steering assist for slide corrections are not something I want on my vehicles. I have heard stories about a few that have put cars into a ditch on a straight road because of an electrical glitch. I have had drunken friends who can help with that, it doesn't require a computer. | ||
| Panhead_dan |
"I did not know that there were road riding incidents where the ability to skid while trying to stop would be useful." Actually, there are but that's not what I said at all. What I said was that a rider needs to develop the skill to use the brake without skidding in order to survive the streets. ABS eliminates the learning of that skill. "Yeah, that's nice, but ultimately irrelevant when ABS is a good as it is. Obviously there's situations where ABS is not going to help you (off road), but for 99% of the time it's better than what a human can do and I would have it on my Buells if I could." That remaining 1% of the time is what I am referring to. It is not confined to off road. It can be very quick. And deadly. What happens when the abs system you have come to trust decides to fail? Hopefully the system defaults to the equivalent of a non-abs system rather than just rendering the brakes inoperative. Even then, you are raising that 1% to the dangerous place I am talking about- no learned skill to modulate the brake over sketchy road surfaces under emergency conditions. ABS is not your friend. Skill is. There are also maint issues that haven't been mentioned yet. | ||
| Ratbuell |
Every single anti-lock system I have ever seen, defaults to a standard-brake mode in case of failure. They kinda design 'em that way. Maintenance issues? What would those be? I have never ever had to "maintain" an anti-lock system any differently than a standard braking system. More components, sure...but none that require maintenance. And if a wheelspeed sensor fails...the system defaults to a normal-brake system, and a light comes on to let you know. Pretty straightforward. And, in case of failure, you DO get a warning light. And failure does not occur during a braking event - at least, not an ABS failure per se. If there's a failure it is typically electronic, and those typically occur at power-up / key-on. And give you the warning light, so you know to get it fixed (and, in theory, to take it easy because you no longer have ABS, if you have come to rely on it). The trick is in the design, keeping the interfere-threshold high enough that it still does good in a panic situation, but does not induce the "wait for it" event that Vern talks about. But I guess its like EFI...it'll never catch on. | ||
| Steveford |
Woodnbow, My 06 Triumph 955i Tiger is a capable Uly replacement. Overall they're fairly similar with a few differences: the Buell handles better and is smaller, the Triumph has a better motor and gearbox, the Buell has better brakes, the Triumph puts out less heat, you get the idea. I like both bikes but the Tiger definitely feels like a more modern motorcycle. I can't imagine taking one off road, though. A little motorcycle it's not! | ||
| Dr_greg |
Well fellas, since my name was mentioned in post 2 of this discussion, I'll throw in a comment...plus it's a rare cloudy day in New Mexico, and---now being retired---I prefer to stay home on Sunday and ride mid-week. So if you also have a lot of time on your hands, read on...it's a saga. Having put a combined 85,000 miles on two '06 Ulys (first totaled on a deer, some of you guys remember that) I feel competent to discuss the beast. I have a dirtbike/sportbike background, been riding since 1957. Retired 68-YO Mechanical Engineering professor, get flak for using nonlinear simultaneous equations to balance my wheels. I'm small in stature at 5-8, 150 lb, and can't pick up any of these big ADV beasts. Tried weight training for a while, but have given up... Now back when I was a competitive cyclist---and a pretty good one, I might add---I could pick up that bike  . Have owned just about everything except Harleys and big touring bikes, and never have behaved like a "hooligan"---was somehow one of those kids who always had self-control, and still enjoyed myself. Yeah, I know...how boring. I disagree. ANYWAY...the Uly was my first "ADV-style" bike, and---to be honest---it probably WAS the most "fun" of any bike I've owned, but it was FAR from perfect. It stranded me FOUR times, almost on successive rides (because of four different malfunctions)---one of those strandings was my journey to Homecoming...got as far as Santa Fe, NM. Sigh. I did ALL my own maintenance---probably one of the few to change the fork oil at the recommended interval of 10K miles; some of you may remember my top-end teardown after blowing out a spark plug (probably the only guy to wash a Uly with the cylinders removed). I always did like the way the Uly "disappeared" when you climbed aboard, although sitting "on top of the front wheel" put off some. And I could barely get my "tippee-toes" on the ground (with regular seat, which I preferred). First Uly replacement was two 2010 Ducati Multistrada 1200S's, on which I put 50,000 miles (first totaled on hoarfrost, some of you guys remember that---hmm, do I detect a pattern here?). MTS was a pretty sweet ride---IMHO handled as well as the Uly, and pretty dang fun to ride at that. But I couldn't do all my own maintenance anymore (the packaging of the 4V desmo defeated me, although I do my own 2V desmo maintenance on my '92 Ducati 900SS), and I didn't like having a chain. BTW, I'd had belt issues on the Uly, and more than once cursed EB for not allowing belt tracking adjustment, etc. Although not being a hooligan, the Multistrada (best bike for passing people) made me scare myself a few times... During both the ownership of the Uly and MTS I'd thought about the "classic" ADV bike: the BMW R1200GS. So I test-rode a couple: an '08 R1200GS, and a '10 R1200GS LE. Didn't like the '08 at all; the '10 was better, but both felt TOO BIG (was glad to climb back aboard the Uly both times). Then BMC went belly-up (which I found out about while on my way home from a trip) and I bought my first Multistrada 1200S. Then the new "water-cooled" (cylinder heads only) 2013 BMW R1200GS arrived, and I stopped by the BMW dealer---the GM was the former GM from the Albuquerque H-D/Buell dealership, and we had a great reunion (we are fortunate in ABQ to have an excellent BMW dealer, and---while it lasted---an excellent Buell dealer). So I took an extended test-ride on the new "GSW" and WOW...two days later I owned one. Either the bike had changed, or I'd changed...probably some of both, but mainly the bike. So from June 2013 to now I've amassed 54,791 miles. And the GSW has been BULLETPROOF. Only had to replace one fork seal---a simple DIY job that was much easier than on the Uly inverted Showa forks, a job I've done also (anyone wanna buy a MotionPro fork seal driver?). I can again do virtually ALL my own maintenance, although BMW parts ARE more expensive. My point is that for the type of riding I do now---long trips, a little off-pavement to get to a campsite, for example---the GSW is perfect. Better than the Uly? You bet. More fun? Maybe not. And the GSW corners pretty well: I had no trouble staying with Etennuly when he showed me around the Great Smokies last fall (a great guy; looking forward to seeing him again). Add in aftermarket support and likelihood of BMW staying in business...after test-riding the GSW, I knew it was a "keeper" so I purchased an extended warranty. That expires in 2019 (should have over 120,000 miles by then), so---as I said here recently---I'll look around at the available bikes. But based on my GSW ownership experience so far, it'll take something very attractive to lure me away. I might just keep the BMW, go for 200,000 miles. I learned a valuable lesson from Mrs. Greg many years ago about "food" but it applies equally well to motorcycles: "motorcycles are not good or bad, it's whether YOU like them or not." I admire some of the engineering in the Uly...the GSW has some damn fine engineering in it also. As some have pointed out, we are fortunate to have as many excellent bike choices these days (and some bikes we unfortunately don't get in the USA). What do I miss most about not owning the Uly? The people. All that I've met have been just wonderful. Although some of them are still willing to talk to me now that I'm a GSW owner...and this forum is the best. I post my Ride Reports on ADV, but it's difficult to have a civil discussion over there... Doubt if many of the denizens here are interested in either bike, but some time ago---at the request of one of the ADV site monitors---I wrote up a comparison between the Multistrada 1200S and R1200GSW, you can find it HERE. Sorry for "rambling on" so much, but I have time on my hands today and I enjoy writing (I'm currently writing my memoir, 450 pages so far and I'm only in 11th grade ). Anyone volunteer to proofread when it's done? Cheers, --Doc |
