| Author | Message | ||
     Danair |
Doing the timing after replacing cps. Even with plugs removed, the valvetrain whips the timing mark by just as it gets centered up. Not enough hands/eyes to do all at once and see mark. Took a video with sound and its slightly advanced.....a marks width or less. Nowhere near the manual illustration. Close enough? | ||
| Etennuly |
Are you having a pinging problem? If so it may need backed off a little. It took three people, the bike jacked up and in fourth gear, one reading the marks, one turning and holding the rear tire, and another looking at the lap top. It is a SOB of a thing to get accurately locked down. You could mark the housing for where you are starting and back it off a notch at a time to try it. | ||
| Uly_man |
"Doing the timing after replacing cps". Use ECM-SPY if it is a 06 bike. Put the swing arm on a stand, take out the timing plug, remove the timing cover, slack off the timing plate fixings, remove the headlight plug (if you want), hook up ECM-SPY, go to the testing screen, rotate the rear wheel (in gear) until the timing marks line up and then move the timing plate until ECM-SPY says it is at TDC. Put it all back together. I think that is right but it is a long time since I did it last. You can also use a timing "strobe light" if you have one. Or at least I think you could. PS - I do not recall any problems doing it on my 06 bike and I did not remove the plugs either. If you do just hold the rear wheel in place until the cylinder compression bleeds past the piston rings. (Message edited by uly_man on August 13, 2013) | ||
| Danair |
Thanks all. I've done these before but with a helper, so I'm familiar with the process. As I stated the plugs are out, so no compression to deal with but the valve springs at that precise point want to spin the crank one way or the other. And with surprising force! Its on a stand, in 5th gear, ECMspy hooked up, red screen as mark becomes visible in left of window, indicating front is coming up on compression TDC, etc. Don't want to go backwards back to mark as most anything like this will be inaccurate do to gear lash. Just hard to be laid out using foot to bump wheel, eye and light lined up to see mark with no parallax. Bike does not ping so I'm just asking if a marks width or less is OK. If it was on the retarded side (like me), I wouldn't even consider it. Or, I'll just wait for a buddy to help do the bump wheel hold brake method. | ||
| Uly_man |
Well apart from the fact that you do not need to re-time the bike after fitting a new CPS I am not sure what is going on. Unless the Uly has one that can be adjusted. As I said I have done this on my own before with no problem. As long as the timing marks are in-line that is all you need. If you have a problem holding it then lock the engine position in place by using the foot brake. | ||
| Danair |
"It is a SOB of a thing to get accurately locked down." I've done 3 of these and the parts are totally unfinished. The slightest bit of anything near snug yet adjustable does not exist. I just wound up taking them back out and de-burring the slots and hold downs and contact surfaces. Makes it way easier to make minute movements of that plate. And those fancy black Harley rivets that are yada yada.....that hole id already the correct I.D. for a 10/32 | ||
| Danair |
"Well apart from the fact that you do not need to re-time the bike after fitting a new CPS I am not sure what is going on. Unless the Uly has one that can be adjusted." Might want to check the manual on that!! Cheers | ||
| Uly_man |
What you or me? Unless I am mistaken or that is adjustable the CPS works on a Hall effect and has a fixed position. That is a magnetic pickup off the crank as is it on the timing but the timing plate has the adjustment if you need it. Maybe someone could inform me otherwise? | ||
| Garrcano |
The CPS comes fixed to a plate. This plate hasn't a fixed position on the bike, because of the need to rotate the assembly for adjusting the timing. | ||
| Reepicheep |
If you don't replace the CPS and plate, you could probably scribe it and carefully line it back up. But if you are replacing the CPS, you absolutely must reset the timing. And the timing is sometimes off from the factory anyway, why not re-time it. It isn't difficult and requires no special tools. | ||
| Steveford |
It's been a while since I've done it but I'd first do static timing on a cold motor and listen for the fuel pump kicking on and set it right where it makes the pump kick on. Then it was to the Digital Tech and there's a magic temperature number where you want the spark to read right at 0 degrees TDC. I'm not trying to be intentionally vague, the temperature where the timing should go to O degrees is the same temperature that the manual says to set the voltage for when doing the TPS reset. Run the motor up to x number of degrees and set the voltage to 5.2-5.6 or whatever it is. Strange but true. To answer your question, it has to be dead-on perfect as the timing on these affects the fuel delivery. I may not remember my instructor's name up at Milwaukee but I do remember that part! (Message edited by SteveFord on August 13, 2013) | ||
| Steveford |
By popular demand, from page 1-49 in the 2006 Uly shop manual run vehicle until engine temp is 320 degrees F (160 degrees C). Set idle to 1050-1150 RPM. When the engine temp hits 320 the timing should go to O degrees. Not before, not after, right at 320 degrees. That also addresses the previous topic how do I know that my bike is running right. Get that right and assuming there are no other issues your bike will run right. I hope this helps. | ||
| Argentcorvid |
They are talking about the Sportster-style CPS that is under the round cover on the right side of the engine. This was up until the 2008 motor, when they re-did the cam and oil pump cover; it was driven off a cam gear. | ||
| Danair |
Thanks, thats good info. Is there a difference between the "2006 Uly shop manual" and my Buell 99494-06Y "Official Factory Manual"? Your temp and timing method makes perfect sense but I can find no mention in my manual about the temp/timing relationship. Does this mean the center of the window is a start point and timing is later adjusted to make 320 and 0 coincide. If so, I'd like to get me one of them there "shop manuals" | ||
| Steveford |
This procedure is from my instructor at the Buell XB Tech School in Milwaukee, Wisconsin, circa 2003, 2004 somewhere around there. For the life of me I can't remember his name but he was a really good guy who Erik managed to hire away from McClaren (sic?) Racing and he was instrumental in the windage plate/tray and muffler on your XB models. I don't believe this procedure is in the manual but the temperature certainly is. That's why they're very specific about the temperature for setting the idle after the TPS/AFV reset. One correction, I should have said "the temperature where you set the idle speed at", not the voltage. The temperature data is from the factory 2006 Ulysses Service Manual and I believe that it would only apply to the XBs up until 2007. Happy timing! (Message edited by SteveFord on August 14, 2013) (Message edited by SteveFord on August 14, 2013) | ||
| Danair |
That method made a nice smooth difference! If my idle is above 1000 the rpm's hang, which its always done. Advance went to zero right at 160.Very pleased with the results. Each of my 3 Uly's have always had different preferences about tps reset. 1 doesn't like being snapped closed, 1 must have it, and the other gently closing it till it touches. 1 even ran best when I gave up and did it cold. Haven't touched that one since. Thanks again. | ||
| Steveford |
After work I'll sit down with a manual and write up a step by step instruction sheet. It's a one person job which takes a little bit but isn't too difficult. Do it once and you're done. | ||
| Buewulf |
"he was instrumental in the ... muffler on your XB models. " Too bad you can't remember his name. Let me know if you think of it. I'd like to slap him with a bucket of rust!  That is a great tip on the timing procedure. Thanks! | ||
| Steveford |
My instructor is hardly the person to blame for the choice of coating suppliers. The B-last Pro Series exhaust came in a box that said Hooker Headers so I think that's who you can blame for the rusted out cannisters like my race XB one. | ||
| Buewulf |
I know what you mean by "instrumental". I certainly meant no offense to you or your instructor. Only a joke. |
