| Author | Message | ||
     Muppet |
Hi Guys, Very long time no post, for which I apologise but well, you know, life and all that.... Just had another terminal engine failure on my 06 model Uly. Some basic info for you: 38,000 miles. Motor first blew at 21,000, needing a bottom end rebuild after rear cylinder big end shell picked up - plenty of oil, but was running hard for 12 hours in 30 degrees C of heat. That was fixed under warranty, 4 years ago. Scroll forward to last week, returning from a tour round Slovenia & Croatia - high temps again, 32c. Had an instance of top end knocking when we got there, so I changed the oil as a precaution (had only just changed it before the trip, and it'd only done about 1,000 miles. All seemed ok until a week later, when it got very hot again and started knocking. Couldn't find right grade of oil so didn't change it again. On the journey home, it seemed fine, ran perfectly for 3 days and then suddenly I was losing power and when I stopped it died. Trying to restart and it sound like a bag of spanners in a washing machine, but from the top end, so I suspect it's picked up a small end shell this time. I will admit now to not using HD oil, but a proprietory 20-50, so it's probably my own stupid fault - still bloody annoying though as I religious checked the oil twice a day on the trip and it was never low, although it had got through over a pint before it went pop. The bike is still in France, but will be back with me in a couple of weeks so I'll start stripping it down then, but I think I know what I will find. So, my question to you all is: can I rebuild this motor with stronger parts, stronger bearings/shells etc, that will make it more reliable. I'm going to invest in some mods to make it run cooler - Right side scoop and possibly an uprated/larger oil cooler, but I want the thing to be able to take the heat. What would you guys do? Is there some kind of kit to upgrade this motor? I love the bike, but it's not reliable enough for me and soon I won't be able to get breakdown/recovery cover on it. Oh, I'm based in the UK if you didn't know, and I'm not sure what upgraded parts are available this side of the pond. Thanks in advance for any help/advice. (Message edited by muppet on June 26, 2013) | ||
| Hughlysses |
Wow- that's rough luck. If you want to upgrade your existing engine, I don't think there's a whole lot available aftermarket. The factory did do some decent upgrades- the main thing you can do is install a 2008-up crankshaft and connecting rods. You'll also have to change the crankshaft primary sprocket to match. The 08-up crank has a larger crankpin and rod bearings, and higher strength rods. The next step up from that would be to install a complete 2008-up engine which has the better crankshaft assembly and an improved oiling system, larger oil cooler, etc. This will require you to install a 2008 wiring harness and ECM to match the revised ignition trigger and fuel injection. Having done this myself, it'd probably be simpler to just buy a 2008-up Uly and part out your 06 bike. Good luck! | ||
| Teeps |
I suggest trying to find a low mile 2010 engine assy, including, throttle body, wire harness and ECM... call it good as it's going to get. Or, just get a Triumph. | ||
| General_ulysses |
Sorry to hear of your problems muppet, I'd be pissed too. Out of curiosity does your bike have the rider comfort kit on it? I have an '06 Uly and it definitely ran hotter without the comfort kit. Adding that air scoop on the right side really helped to cool down the rear cylinder. I also run Amsoil full synthetic 20-50 which holds up better to the extreme heat the the air cooled engine can produce. But I'd really check the timing. If you were experiencing a lot of preignition due to the timing being off, I can easily see how that would overheat the engine and detonate pistons and crank. Also, make sure it's not running too lean, that can also make it run very hot. | ||
| Uly_man |
Man thats a pain. Sorry to hear this. You can use any 20w50 oil as long as, in my opinion, it is a brand name and not a "Tesco or Halfords special". And yes a fully synthetic oil is much better if your running the bike in very hot ambient conditions. The 06 engine, or mine did, runs way to hot which of course will put a big strain on the oil. The 06 bikes, in my opinion, run on the lean side so if you have put a can on the bike I hope you used a fueler or a ECM map update otherwise the bike would have run even hotter. The "comfort kit" seems to have many forms. The one you want is the one that seals the side outlets and directs the air out the back. The later bikes have a fan control via the ECM but the 06 bike is DDFI-2 and this can not be done. If I still had my 06 bike I would have rigged the fan with a manual switch to force it on while riding. I would also have tried to find out why the oil cooler on my bike only got warm and not hot as it should have. The thing used to run like it was "on fire". Just as a point of interest my 10 bike oil cooler works fine, it is the 8 over the 6 matrix, and the engine runs very cool. | ||
| Reepicheep |
The 2008 and up motor has a much better oiling system, and beefed up crank bearings. So that's the durability upgrade you are looking for. The top end noise probably isn't a crank bearing... so you might actually have gotten off easier this time, though who knows if other damage was done until you get in there. I also agree with the oil thing... non synthetic will die sooner than synthetic, but it should still have a 2500 mile life span if the engine is otherwise well sorted. | ||
| Dr_greg |
Mrs. Greg said for me to reassure you that it was DEFINITELY not the oil you used. Not your fault! As the owner of two '06's, the remaining one of which also has 38,000 miles, I hope to keep it running for as long as possible. With all "higher-pair" bearings (point/line contact) the Uly (H-D) engine is a bit of an oddball. Other owners know more than I about possible upgrades, although I doubt that much is possible on the '06 engine. I, for one, would like to hear about your saga as the teardown progresses. Thanks in advance. --Doc | ||
| Muppet |
Thanks everyone for your comments and advise. From what you're saying, it's not really worth spending too much time or money on the 06 engine as not much I can do to upgrade it. I'm contemplating giving it to some Harley engine specialist to see what magic might be performed, but that depends on if I can find one, and how much he'll want. I'l also toying with the idea of changing the engine completely for something else, but exactly what, I don't know. I have a perfectly good Honda VFR 800fi (that's an Interceptor on your side) engine sitting in my shed, which could prove an interesting combination, but the output shaft is on the wrong side, the left, so I think that's a non-starter. Maybe I can get hold of an 1125R or CR engine and transplant that in? Would it be the first? An 1125 Uly, the Uly Erik should have built?  I'll keep you posted once I start the dismantling, but it won't be anytime soon, I have to do some work on my house to sell it next year, so the bike is way down on my list of priorities unfortunately. Thanks again for your suggestions, keep 'em coming! Cheers Clive (Message edited by muppet on June 27, 2013) | ||
| Red450 |
Muppet, Your post has me thinking. My bike has 68k and when the engine finally gives up the ghost, I might undertake the 1125 swap. (But only if I have a spare bike to ride.) There are at least 7 engines on ebay right now. | ||
| Dr_greg |
From what you're contemplating, I sincerely hope your best friend owns a machine shop...  --Doc | ||
| Hughlysses |
Maybe I can get hold of an 1125R or CR engine and transplant that in? Would it be the first? An 1125 Uly, the Uly Erik should have built? I don't think the 1125 engine will physically fit in the XB frame, but you could buy an 1125, swap your suspension bits and the tail frame section (it's been done before) and you'd accomplish the same end result. | ||
| Muppet |
Hugh, You're probably right, that might be the easier option, although it would be a shame to dismantle a perfectly good CR/R. Perhaps I might get lucky and find a crashed one. And now I've had a bit of a look at the CR, I've realised of course that the output is on the other side compared to the XB, so it'll need a hell of a lot of work, as Dr Greg rightly points out. I'm in no hurry, I've resigned myself to a bikeless summer now for the rest of this year, so I'll take my time and look into all the options before I go ahead with anything. | ||
| Rdkingryder |
I think the R belt drive is on the other side from the Uly as well. I had thought of doing this when my crank went. Seen tons of R engines on ebay as opposed to the XBs. | ||
| Muppet |
Yes, you're right RDK, it is, and it's just too much work to think of doing. Hughlysses is right, an easier option would be to buy an 1125 of some description and 'Ulyfy' it! I still haven't got the bike back, but from discussing with various people and companies, it would seem that to rebuild the engine properly, with perhaps a slight 'upgrade' in power, would be somewhere in the region of £3k, so around $4.5k which is about all the bikes worth to be honest. Trouble is, there's nothing wrong with the frame/suspension/cycle parts etc., it would be a shame to break it, I really love riding the bike, it fits me and suits my riding style and is all day long comfortable. I think a good way to go will be look for a crashed 1125, either R or CR, that has a straight frame, and work on swapping over suspension and seat frame etc. Probably a cheaper option, and definitely will be more reliable with the added bonus of near 50% increase in power!  | ||
| Rdkingryder |
I tried a CR, too bad the ergonomics put me off of it. I can't imagine the 1125r being more comfortable. That and having more maintenance on a bike is something I went away from when I switched from DL650 to the Ulysses. The Ulysses just feels right to me, even exceeds the XT in comfort due to the longer suspension. |
