| Author | Message | ||
     Gamdh |
2010 Uly with 17K Over the last couple of weeks, I'm getting and intermittent CEL when riding. When it occurs, there is a * momentary lose of power (does not shut off..just a power loss) * the Gauges sweep * Exhaust actuator cycles the entire episode takes 4-5 seconds and then the CEL goes out and the bike runs fine. I can ride for an hour and it might not happen or it might happen 3 or 4 times. I've check battery connections, ground under seat and they are all secure. (have not removed the ground and cleaned yet). Have not checked the ground under the fly screen yet. Didn't want to start taking too many thinks apart as I really have not clue where the problem might originate After the first few times, I checked error codes. Had a code 21 (exhaust actuator), checked the cable was a little loose. I adjusted it and lubed the cable.. tested and it seems to work fine. Rode it a few more times and the problem was still there So, I checked error codes again... this time NO error codes??? I did not do 50 start cycles which IIRC is what is needed to clear stored codes. So, the error codes got cleared somehow.... Oh and last weekend, I started the bike in the garage let it warm up then held the throttle open to 2500 rpm... after a very short time (1-2 minutes) it actually did exactly what I described above. Bike was standing straight up, air box cover off, seat off. Of course I tried to repeat so I could record it...hasn't happen again in the garage (have tried a couple of times). Also tried wiggling ECM and connections etc.. while it was running .. nothing happened. Could a bad/flaky ECM cause this? Could an intermittent short cause something like this? I'm really at a loss as to where to even start... any ideas on where to start? | ||
| Djohnk |
I would say check the ECM more closely ... unbolt it and lightly put pressure on the gray connector under bright light. Look closely between the gray connector and the black ECM body to see if it is cracked. Have you relocated it? Is there evidence of the seat rubbing it? Also, I have had similar problems with the CEL coming on momentarily when my exhaust actuator sticks, but I don't get loss of power. Mine opens and closes alot because I have it programmed to open between I think 900 RPM and 3500 RPM. I don't worry about it because I know what is going on and it happens infrequently. | ||
| Gamdh |
Djohnk... think the ECM might be it. The spacer block shows some wear as expected.. there looks to be the very slight rubbing on the very corner of the grey plug. Really not much.. had to look at an angle before I could tell. But, there is definitely a small crack from the corner of the grey. If you are looking at the side where the plugs are it comes from the upper side of the plug. So, that kind of makes sense. Probably did originally have a sticky exhaust valve, but have the codes randomly clear sounded like a flaky ECM. I have not relocated the ECM as I never did that on my '06 which now has 74K miles with no ECM issues. Maybe its time for an EBR ECM and a drummer ... and then to relocate the ECM. Thanks for the insight!!! | ||
| Froggy |
I say your issue is power, not ECM | ||
| Gamdh |
how so Froggy? | ||
| Garrcano |
The gauges sweep after the instrument cluster gets its power supply again, which is not controlled by the ECM. Steady supply from battery: red wire on pin 2. Power from key switch: grey/orange wire on pin 12. Ground: black wire on pin 13. Check also the ground connection on the frame just behind the main lights. | ||
| Garrcano |
P.D. There is a soldered splitting on the red wire which goes to the key switch and to the instrument cluster. It's hidden inside the loom in the region where it bends between the frame and the left fork. | ||
| Gamdh |
Just curious, would that also be true for the exhaust actuator ( as it also cycles)? I asked as when you turn on the kill switch, the gauges sweep when they get power.. but I didn't think the actuator did...was thinking that would be controlled by the ECM and not getting power.. but don't really know. Did I mention electrical problems tend to baffle me =( (Message edited by gamdh on June 10, 2012) | ||
| Garrcano |
Not sure, but probably yes. A short time ago I opened and cleaned mine and after connecting it again, it first made a complete cycle. But it is on an other part of the loom, so as I said, I'm not sure. | ||
| Desert_bird |
Bad bank angle sensor? | ||
| Gamdh |
So, I pulled the fly screen and head light.. looking at the grounds, nothing obviously wrong from just looking at them. Bank angle sensor... how could I tell? | ||
| Djohnk |
When my ECM was cracked http://goo.gl/ouDCR I had many of your symptoms, intermittent CEL, sometimes codes, sometimes not, sudden loss of power (over time it gradually worsened to the engine dying and backfiring through the intake) but I don't remember seeing my gauges sweep. Also I didn't have the problem unless I was sitting on the bike and it was warm, allowing the seat pan to flex. I bow to the others expertise because I have only had my 'Uly for about a year, and I know they know a lot more about Buells than I do. Once you solve the problem let us know, I sure am curious what it is. | ||
| Gamdh |
Djohnk ..Me too... do you have a pic of that ecm crack with a little less zoom.. also I was just running it and it happened again.. but not nearly as noticeable as before and the actuator did not cycle. (have the headlights off the bike). This time, the CEL came on.. a slight power loss (similar to before just not as bad), my aux lights kind of blinked (they are LEDs).. what I noticed is that the gauge did not really sweep like when you turn the ignition on. It simple dropped from 2500 down (not to zero) and then came back up to 2500 fairly quickly, so not really sweeping... just a quick drop and a return. In a few tests prior to that, with bike running I've wiggled the ECM and connectors, main harness under fly screen, grounds under fly screen etc.. pretty much every wire I could get my hands on.. nothing happened in those cases. This last time I was just letting it run and rev'd it to 2500 and held it and it happened. Rechecked for error codes. .still no codes. | ||
| Desert_bird |
The only way (that I know) to diagnose a faulty bank angle sensor is to replace it with a working one. Mine went bad twice. NO codes, just sudden recurring engine/electrical start-stop conditions when running, usually tripped by a certain frequency engine vibration. | ||
| Djohnk |
Sorry, that's the only picture I have, but its a view of the top of the ECM Showing where the gray connector meets the black body of the ECM. | ||
| Djohnk |
I circled in red what you are looking at: http://bit.ly/LJEpF3 http://goo.gl/ouDCR | ||
| Gamdh |
Thanks! I can see some separation in that area on mine when I apply pressure.. but does not look exactly the same as yours. Where I see cracking is actually between the connectors, but it starts on the upper edge of the grey connector. | ||
| Djohnk |
Crackings not good, even if that turns out to not be the problem, I would take preventative action. Do a search here for information on how people protect their ECMs from damage. | ||
| Uly_man |
"I say your issue is power, not ECM." So would I but you can never be sure with this bike. The dials only test/sweep on a "power up" but it could be a + or - problem. It could anything in the system like bad kill switch contacts, ignition switch and/or many other things. I had a problem with my 2010 bikes side stand. This uses a magnetic switch system and mine would cut out the bike if I lent it over to far? Very strange but a new one fixed the problem. "Did I mention electrical problems tend to baffle me". I thought I had some idea until I bought a XB. You never get bored with the bike though. Its either a great ride or a great mind teaser to fix the problems. Not so good for some though I guess. | ||
| Garrcano |
Pull on the four black wires on the ground connection behind the main lights. Sometimes the copper core breaks inside the insulation without any outer visible effect. | ||
| Gamdh |
So, some more time in the garage. I've wiggled, pulled and touched everything I can get my hands on with the bike running...none of that caused the problem to occur. I have had it happen 2 times while I was running it holding steady between 2 - 2.5K Still have headlights off Disconnected Aux lighting (LEDs) The symptoms have change slightly - The event does not seem to be as severe - Still have a slight power loss (engine power) - CEL for a few seconds as before - The Exhaust actuator no longer cycles - As pointed out above, the gauges are not sweeping like start up the tack just drops a little and then comes back up. Speedometer does nothing as I'm not moving =).. but also does not sweep. - I had the multimeter on the battery during one occurrence. Best I could tell voltage held steady @14.1v +/-. I was looking at the gauges and looked as quickly has possible.. so don't think it dropped or spiked. Thanks for all the input...any more ideas greatly appreciated. | ||
| Gamdh |
Have had no time to do much with the bike since my last post, But I did find this thread in the KV.. virtually identical symptoms.. http://www.badweatherbikers.com/buell/messages/384 2/649439.html?1329493972 PM'd the O.P.... he confirmed it was a bad ECM on his issue. | ||
| Banzai |
my 07 uly will dye while vertical if nudged replacing bank angle sensor bad one being cut open when new one shows up my .02c | ||
| Gamdh |
for the record... replaced the ECM with an EBR ECM....(and a drummer for good measure).. running good again. A week's riding to/from work, plus a trip to Charleston and back... over 1K miles and no issues. |
