| Author | Message | ||
     Kevinaye |
Hey All, I am still in Ecuador on my Uly. I have a new rear tire and my fork seals arrved from American Sportbike in 7 days!! It really nice to have these guys in your corner! Now I seem to have developed a bit of a splutter when I try to open the throttle on my Uly. It idles no problem and if I get the revs up over 4k it seems better but in between it feels like it is having an issue getting gas. I could be "bad gas" as everyone likes to blame fuel issues on down here. I have checked the battery connections and grounds so far. The 77 connector has been changed out. I am riding between 9000ft an 11000ft, which has not been an issue before. I will check the plugs next if nothing improves. I was also thinkinjg about adding some fuel injector cleaner to see if that helps. Anybody got any suggestions for what else I should check??? | ||
| Dio |
I'm not wishing you any ill will or hard luck, but what are the symptoms with a breaking or broken throttle shaft? There have been several posted here, both '06 and '07. | ||
| Kevinaye |
That doesn't sound good....I liked the bad gas explanation much better. I am not even sure what a throttle shaft is. I'll see if I can find the posts in the archives. Cheers. | ||
| Ratbuell |
Pull your airbox. Pull your air filter. Pull the air filter base. Look down. The throttle is the "mouth" the engine breathes through. The throttle plate is a round disc that pivots out of the way when you twist the grip. The throttle shaft is what that plate is mounted to, with 2 screws. | ||
| Desert_bird |
Kevin. I'm just throwing out some broad ideas that it might be related to; intake manifold leaks, faulty ecm, improper fuel pressure, charging system issues, faulty spark plugs, coil, or wires (pull a plug and see how the your firing), leaky/plugged injectors, faulty injector circuits, bad oxygen sensor, dirty/faulty intake air temperature sensor. Have you reset your TPS, and checked condition of TPS terminal and wires? They can get chaffed pretty easily up there near the vibrating heads. Has your engine light come on at all? If so, checking your engine codes would be an instructive place to begin troubleshooting. DB | ||
| Natexlh1000 |
I would think that contaminated gas is the most likely thing. A little water goes a long way in making an engine run like crap. It's heavier than gas so i will collect at the fuel pickup areas. Your symptom sounds like the symptoms from my lawnmower when its float bowl had a glob or water in the bottom. Idles fine but as soon as you ask more from the engine, the thing would stutter out. I know our bikes don't have float bowls but if there was a small bubble of water in the bottom of your tank, perhaps it would behave about the same? I would suggest draining off a pint from that little valve on the fuel pump hatch into a container and looking it over for signs of contamination. | ||
| Uly_man |
At 10,000ft its on the margin for O2 but as you say it should run ok. You tend to lose power and not splutter. It could be many things though. I would start with the simple/easy/basic things first. Use a "step-by-step" system to the problem otherwise you will confuse the issue. Use logic to eliminate each possible problem. If you have not done it yet clean off the PAINT on the subframe battery Earth mount. I know I keep going on about this but it causes all manner of engine running problems even if everything else on the bike works ok. Trust me I know. Checking they are tight is NOT ENOUGH. Check the plugs are not fouled or you have any water/damp around the top of the engine. My 06 bike did this if it had been standing in rain or damp conditions. It was fine once it had dried out. A spray with ACF-50 fixed it and had no problems after that. A TPS reset will fix all manner of problems as well. Make sure you air filter is clean. Try a fuel additive. Make sure the battery/charge system is above 11.1v with the bike running as the ECM does not like it below that. It can get confused because of the low volts. "I am not even sure what a throttle shaft is." I am not being rude or anything but I would have thought you would be more aware of the bike for a trip like this. I wish you well and hope it all works out for you. | ||
| Etennuly |
Where you are and being at over 10,000 feet of elevation, if the bike has been running fine, these symptoms just started, I would also be looking at fuel. Not only for contamination or water, but too low of an octane for that altitude. Does it ping on acceleration? Pulling the plugs can give you a reading on what it is doing as to too lean or rich. Bad fuel could have plugged the pick-up strainer and or filter in the tank. Idling well and running at top end OK can also indicate muffler valve not operating. Have you checked for ECM codes? | ||
| Kevinaye |
Hey All, thanks for the input. I'll get into it tonight. My engine light has not come on at all. I also had to have my computers operating system re istalled after a meltdown. The guy working on it installed windows 7 which I am not sure is compatible with ECM spy. I have reinstalled the program but I haven't tried to hook it up yet. My Uly is barley running now. Still idles just fine but it is not happy doing much else. Just made it to the largest town in the area that looks alot like the city in "The Omega Man", ie a total dump. The altitude is not the issue. I am back at sea level and it still is still barley running. If the muffler valve is not working, will that cause the bike to run poorly? | ||
| Desert_bird |
Hey Kevin. Sorry to hear of the problems. A screwy muffler valve would not lead to the adverse issues you are experiencing. Have you burnt through a full tank of gas yet? Funky, dirty, or watery gas would be a culprit down here. Also, spray some starter fluid around the intake manifold when the bike is idling and revving. Fluctuations in the the way the motor runs means an intake leak. Double check grounds, and look for any loose or chaffed wires near the heads. And pull a plug and see what the electrode looks like. Happy to do some trouble shooting with you over Skype. DB | ||
| Ulyranger |
I'm with Uly_man, check the main ground from the battery to the sub-frame. I had engine cut outs, stutters and intermittent CEL. Between the thread locking compound on ground bolt and the paint on the subframe made for very high resistance....not a good thing for a ground. | ||
| Kevinaye |
Well the good news is the throttle shaft is NOT the issue. I checked the battery it shows 12.8 v with the bike off 12.4 v idle 13.4 v 3000rpm (Is this a bit low?) When I pulled the airbox it was pretty messy in there. I have cleaned up the oil and the sensor. I'll pull the plugs next. Theres lots of dirt around the plug and I had nothing to clean it with last night. The filter looks ok except for one batch of dirt on the right hand side. Its a K and Filter. So I'll have to find the solution to clean it and recharge it. The grounds are all solid. I'll take the advice to clean the paint off around the contact point for the ground from the battery terminal. I can't see any broken wires around the heads or the ECM. The lead for the front plug came off too easily and I thought that may have been the issue but its not. It doesn't Ping when accelerating, as the gas has been good in Ecuador. DB, Thanks for the offer of help via Skype. I may have to take you up on it. Are you still in Brazil? I'll keep working on it today and try to contact you later if nothing is working out. BTW, I don't know if I mentioned it already but I stayed at the Shamrock in Medellin, Colombia. They said you were there on your way through. | ||
| Desert_bird |
Hi Kevin Ya, Shamrock is good dudes. And Medellin wasn't all too bad either! Sounds like your battery is in fine shape, but you should be getting a little more juice in your system at 3000 rpm. Battery charging voltage should be 14.4-14.7 v. at anything above idle and without peripherals running. You may want to run a stator and VR test to begin eliminating possible issues with your electrical system. Still, that shouldn't be a the source of the poor running issues. The following bwb post is instructive for checking Uly's baseline electrics: http://www.badweatherbikers.com/cgibin/discus/show.cgi?tpc=32777&post=1400571#POST1400571 Send a pick of what the plug electrode looks like. You may want to clean the inside of the throttle with some starter fluid as well, and wipe off the air temperature thingy as well. I'm still down in Brazil. Happy to chat a bit. Send me an email and we can follow up with Skype. DB (Message edited by Desert_bird on February 20, 2012) | ||
| Tootal |
+1 on the air temperature thinky! That sensor should not be allowed to get wet, that's why some of us did the reroute on the breather. I would clean this sensor well and hopefully it's still ok. | ||
| Mnrider |
Do a good check of the spark plug wires. Spray soapy water on the wires with the engine running and look for sparks jumping. | ||
| Natexlh1000 |
I strongly disagree about the intake air temperature sensor being sensitive to oil. My X1 has had the same oil-soaked air temp sensor now since day one from the factory 12 years and 85K miles ago. | ||
| Froggy |
The 1125R uses the same air temp sensor, it is exposed to the elements as it is right at the mouth of the air intake below the flyscreen between the radiator fans. I know for a fact it gets wet and runs fine. | ||
| Kevinaye |
It's not ...... the intake air temperature sensor spark plug wires spark plugs Grounds ECM ECM wires tps wires Air filter throttle shaft Coil connection Battery still cant do a TPS reset as I can't get the driver to work on my computer. And just found out I dont have a 1/2 socket to drain the fuel tank. So thats slowing me down. A centre stand would really help for this too  | ||
| Desert_bird |
So you haven't yet burnt through the full tank of gas? How long has it been doing this? Is there consensus concerning poor running and low voltage output. Wouldn't seem so, but 13.3v is too low. Maybe screwing with ECM? TPS reset on '08 and higher is easy as 1,2,3. Not that that helps one bit now. I'm guessing you have pleny o'beer around. | ||
| Ratbuell |
Spray some carb cleaner / brake cleaner / some sort of aerosol around the intake seals when the bike is running - where the intake meets the heads, and where the throttlebody mounts to the intake. Make sure the air filter and baseplate are in place, or you could have aerosol suck into the throttle body and give a false symptom. Carb cleaner or octane boost in the tank can't hurt, either. I'd dump in some FI cleaner or octane boost first. Cheap, easy...could fix it, and no tools required  | ||
| Kevinaye |
I may have found the issue ! Chafed wire in the fuel pump assembly. Got it patched, but haven't had a chance to road test it yet. Loading up today and heading towards Peru....... The first thingI tried was fuel injector cleaner. It would have been really nice if that was the issue. DB I had gone though a tank and a half with this issue. It got gradually worse. It does seem to charge no problem. When I had stator issues last year the bike would run just fine even when the battery didnt have enough juice to start it. Thanks again to everybody for all the input. Hopefully I get more than 20 km down the road. | ||
| Etennuly |
My '06 had the fuel pump wires worn through to ground also. It ran well, but had the low fuel light on all of the time. It makes sense that it can also be the wire that makes the pump run shorting. Hope that it was the fix for you! | ||
| Buewulf |
Just an FYI - I run ecmspy on Windows 7 with no issues, but I had to uninstall / reinstall the program and cable driver to get it to work. (I had migrated everything from the drive on my old computer originally.) I hope you found the issue with the fuel pump wire. | ||
| Turf_moor |
kevinaye, I asked on another thread for a report on how you were doing. Didn't realize you had a thread running. Good luck. Hope you've fixed it. | ||
| Al_lighton |
Kevin, Hopefully you found the problem with the chafed fuel pump wire. If not.... You say it idled fine, but not much else. By this, do you mean that sitting on the kickstand, without you on the bike, it idles OK, but then when you get on the bike and try to ride it, it falters? If that's the case, does it matter if you stand up and ride it vs sitting down? I've had that happen on both a Uly and a Lightning. In the case of the Lighting, the seat was putting pressure on an injector wire when you sat on it, and one injector would die. In the case of the Uly, it was the dreaded ECM connector failure, where it would work OK with no seat pressure, but any seat pressure would cause the ECM to do the craked trace thing that Uly's have had issues with, especially if they don't have the seat support post. I pinged you with an email as well. Al | ||
| Kevinaye |
I really thought I had sorted the problem with the chafed wire. I made it over 100km with the Uly running more or less as per usual. Happy days!! However, my fuel problem started again just after crossing into Peru. As before, it got gradully worse as the day went on. I did make it over 400km but was really struggling for the last 50km. Maybe my fix has failed. Which would be good news, as I will at least know the issue. But if it hasn't, it's back to the drawing board. I have made the decision to stick my Uly in a truck and get it to Lima. For a better chance of getting back on the road sooner. Apparently, there is a Harley dealer there. Although, I did get secruity called on me at the last Harley dealer in Ecuador, but that's another story. Lets just say, don't look for any help at Harley, Quito if you own a Buell. If I do have to wait for parts I'd rather be in Lima than any of the last few towns I have been through. Al, thats an interesting idea with standing up. I haven't noticed but will check it out tomorrow. My ECM looks fine, no cracks. Turf Moor, I have just turned 21,000kms since I left Canada. No problems at all until I crossed the Equator. Maybe my Uly just doesn't like this hemishpere | ||
| Al_lighton |
The ECM can fail with a cracked circuit card trace that, for the most part, still conducts. But with the right thermal or mechanical stress, circuits become flaky, and the bike runs flaky. You can't necessarily see it from the outside of the ECM when it occurs, though there is usually a stress crack in the adhesive around the connector, and it's usually pretty obvious there is some rubbing going on on the bottom of the seat. Does your ECM have the seat post installed, as visible here (the tall rectangular support on the forward ECM mounting screw)  . Early 2006 Uly's didn't have them, not sure what month they started adding them. If yours doesn't have it, even if it is NOT the current problem, you should add that post. Even with the seat post, some folks have had issues. Look on the bottom of your seat, if it is contacting, there will be rub marks (see http://www.badweatherbikers.com/buell/messages/142 838/593565.html) . If there are rub marks except for at the seat post itself if you have one, it's a time bomb waiting to happen. I run a corbin seat on my Uly. But if I had a stock seat, I'd get out the dremel tool and relieve the plastic right where the rub marks say there is a potential issue. Other posts on the subject: http://www.badweatherbikers.com/buell/messages/142 838/633887.html#POST2049010 http://www.badweatherbikers.com/buell/messages/142 838/545516.html http://www.badweatherbikers.com/buell/messages/142 838/227886.html http://www.badweatherbikers.com/buell/messages/142 838/597784.html There are lots more stories about this causing general flakiness, the above just scratches the surface. Al (Message edited by al_lighton on February 22, 2012) | ||
| Uly_man |
"Lets just say, don't look for any help at Harley, Quito if you own a Buell." This makes me laugh? You can not, most of the time, find one in even the USA (place of Buell birth) so what made you think you could trust them in that part of the world. | ||
| Turf_moor |
Kevineye. You've gone quiet. Does this mean you're on the road? | ||
| Kevinaye |
I didn't think they would be any better than my previous experiences but I thought I would at least try. I ended up chewing out the german owner for being rude. He had to call his security guards on me. They have guns down here.........so I left without getting shot I don't think he liked the comment about being a tshirt shop that sold bikes on the side. I just or off a 17 hr bus ride to Lima. My uly is on the way on the back of a truck. I have a contact in he KTM shop down here which i hope will help with the diagnosis. I am hoping not to have to wait for parts. Although the last parts I ordered to Ecuador got here in 8 days. Thanks Al ! Btw my ECM has the post installed and I didn't see any cracks. I will have a closer look though. |
