| Author | Message | ||
     Mikef5000 |
My father just picked up an 2008 BMW R1200GS. Loaded to the gills with every option available, as well as tons of Touratech and BMW accessories, plus PIAA lights. 8k miles. He put 103k miles on his Harley over the past decade, and was ready for something new.  We brought it home last night, and I took it out for a spin. Things to note for my test ride: it was 18 degrees out, and getting dark. First off, why did I have it in my head that these bikes were so tall? I must have been staring at the Adventure version too much. The bike came with two seats, tall and low. The tall seat is also adjustable 3 ways. As it sits right now, it has the tall seat on it in the lowest position. My 29" inseam had no problem at all. It was close to the same, if not 1/4" lower than my XT. With the low seat, I could easily flat foot both sides. Next, This thing free-revs fast! I'm sure it's because I'm used to the 300 lb. flywheel feeling of our Buells, but it took some serious adjusting on my part to get it to shift smooth (the revs would drop too low so quick letting the clutch back out was ugly). Not a plus or minus to either bike, just a neutral point. Engine: The engine is plenty powerful, and I could see how first gear would throttle the front wheel up. BUT! The thing I like about my V-twin, is that power is there from the get-go. With my XB's you are good to go from about 1700 RPM. Obviously you wouldn't want to race from there, but nice easy cruising is just fine, and won't lug the motor one bit. Around town I often shift around 2500 RPM. With the BMW, the engine is a no-go till 3000 RPM. Period. The whole 2000-3000 range is extremely rough, with heavy vibration, and obvious lugging of the motor. I don't like that at all. The thing does have a 1000 rpm higher red line, but apparently it needs it, as power doesn't kick in till 1000 rpm later. A note about redline: My 2005 XB, I can feel power start to decrease as I close in on redline. My 2009 XB pulls nice and strong all the way to the rev limiter. This BMW, power drops off significantly before the redline, I'd say about 1000 rpm before the redline. The engine, I'll give the nod to the Buell. Brakes: Pretty equivalent, great powerful front brakes, terribly weak rear brakes. The BMW has ABS too, although I didn't get into it. I guess that means the BMW wins? Unless you want to figure weight, then the Buell dominates. Can we call it even then? Suspension: I didn't adjust it for my weight, nor test it much; 17 degree roadways aren't the place to test handling. I didn't do any off-roading, but I can tell you that the BMW has a lower seat height and higher ground clearance (5.9" XT v. 7.9" BMW), as well as more suspension travel (4.9" XT v. 6.9" BMW), not to mention a plethora of more suited off road tires available. We'll give the nod to the BMW. The regular Uly would help in a couple of these areas, but that's not what I'm comparing it too, and in the end the BMW would still win here. Gas mileage is similar, and the BMW holds almost a gallon more. A small detail that appeared HUGE last night... the BMW heated grips are TERRIBLE! Exhaling on the palms of my hands every minute or so would have worked about as well as these grips. Both my OEM heated grips as well as my Poly-Heater grips work better on the low setting than these on the high setting. Luggage. This is huge. These BMW bags are quite possibly my favorite bags of all time. First off, I will have you note how little 'hardware' is left on the bike when the bags are removed:  Next to none, a bolt and a couple rubber bumpers. Now note that all three bags, (topcase and side cases) are hard shell, 100% waterproof, and EXPANDABLE. Here are the side bags: Not expanded:  Pull a lever on the inside, and they pop out another 2". Same with the top case, it raises up another 2". It's hard to explain, but a genius design. The biggest bummer is that the muffler goes up the tail, and cuts a huge chunk out of one of the two side cases. I'd pay good money to fit these bags to the uly. Too bad it won't/can't happen. The windshields are equally useless. I was very disappointed with the PIAA lights. I guess they're more for 'being seen' than for seeing more. Because the difference between low beam, and low beam + fogs was extremely minimal. I'll still with my Walmart fog lights thank you very much. In the end, I'm jealous of the tire size and luggage, but I'll take my XT. A little side note.... I bought my 09 XT new for $8500 OTD respectively. My buddy bought his 09 KLR650 for $5500 OTD respectively. My dad bought this slightly used 08 GS for $15000. That means I could have my new XT, a new KLR, and have a grand leftover for panniers and heated grips for the KLR, all for the same price as a used (loaded, low mileage) BMW. In that regard, it's a darn nice bike, but NOT for me. | ||
| 7873jake |
My wife was desperately in pursuit of a K-series LT before I bought the Uly (the K-LT is as far from the GS as one could get, granted) until I asked her to go to service manager at the BMW dealer and ask how much a list of 5 common service items would cost as miles added up. She came back befuddled and disappointed. Don't forget that TCO factor as well. (Message edited by 7873jake on January 29, 2010) | ||
| Mnrider |
Nice looking bike but as you say too much $$ for my budget. | ||
| Dr_greg |
Some may recall that I took an extended ride on one of those things last Fall as a reaction against the demise of Buell. Yes, the GS does some things OK, but I'll never own one. Just too darn big for me. To say nothing of $$$. --Doc | ||
| Dentguy |
A little side note.... I bought my 09 XT new for $8500 OTD respectively. My buddy bought his 09 KLR650 for $5500 OTD respectively. My dad bought this slightly used 08 GS for $15000. That means I could have my new XT, a new KLR, and have a grand leftover for panniers and heated grips for the KLR, all for the same price as a used (loaded, low mileage) BMW. In that regard, it's a darn nice bike, but NOT for me. Thanks for the write up/comparison. I understand your point about the money and I assume you bought after the announcement for that price, but maybe you should compare a few other things to be fair. 08 GS loaded with bags was probably $17,000 new MSRP. 08 XT was about $13,000 new MSRP. Probably fair to say that the GS is now worth $15,000 since that's what your dad paid. What can you get for a 08 XT? So the GS lost about $2,000. The XT, maybe $6,000 or possibly $7,000 if somebody paid MSRP. I would say many did pay that or close to it before the announcement. They're all only worth what someone will pay anyway and I'm sure some GS's sell for less and some XT's sell for more. I know most don't buy a bike as an investment and I don't either, but that's a huge difference. Resale value doesn't decide what I buy, but it is a factor since I usually get tired of a bike after a few years. I like them both. Yes the GS cost more, but it is worth more (resale) and that extra money does get you a lot of extra stuff. Some people don't want more stuff, but some do. (Message edited by dentguy on January 29, 2010) | ||
| Ulykan |
So the GS lost about $2,000. The XT, maybe $6,000 or possibly $7,000 if somebody paid MSRP. I would say many did pay that or close to it before the announcement. They're all only worth what someone will pay anyway and I'm sure some GS's sell for less and some XT's sell for more. @ Denguy, Mike made some very good points and although I have never tried and never will try a GS, some of your points are well taken. Many of your points went into my consideration of a Uly instead of a GS. Is the GS actually worth more? That's a matter of opinion to the one who buys it. For the $ spent, for most people, it isn't worth the extra $6K, especially when you add in the true cost of ownership such as service and parts. The GS resale value is much greater than the Uly but over the long term I still think the Uly is a better overall value. YMMV | ||
| Blake |
No comparison. The Uly is a better bike and costs less. | ||
| Ulyssesmatt |
Why is that? They seem like very comparable bikes to me. I rode a GS back in October and liked it quite a bit. Disclaimer: I'm not trolling, I'm actually just curious about your reasoning. The price difference is obvious | ||
| Mikef5000 |
Here's my problem with your resale value argument. I don't buy bikes for the resale. In fact, when I'm done with the bike, it generally will have no resale. My dad just found this out the hard way. He bought a $20k Harley ten years ago. Guess what it's worth now? Next to nothing. Why? He rode it! It now has 104k miles on it, and is next to impossible to sell. No dealership around here would take it as a trade in. Not a single one. So if you think about it this way... You can spend $15,000 on the BMW, or $8000 on the Buell, and with either 100k miles, or a blown motor (whichever comes first) they're both going to be worth the same.... diddly. But that's me, and I'm not normal. I know a handful of guys that sell every 3-4 years, usually with about 20k on the clock. They might care a bit more about resale. | ||
| Mikef5000 |
Also, you are correct it's not fair to compare the new lowered price uly to the standard price GS, but I'm comparing what's available right now. Apples to Apples. And one final note... I forgot to review the tranny... It's smooth (equivalent to the XB's), but has 6 speeds. A nice plus. | ||
| Gambito |
I've got one of each - an '09 GS Adventure I bought in May and an XB12X purchased in November. They now have 18,500km and 1,600km respectively, so my experience with the Uly is limited. It's funny how they're so similar on the spec sheet, but completely different beasts to ride. The BMW invites you to relax and just ride, and ride, and ride - why would you stop when you've got a 600km+ range in the tank. The Buell taunts you to twist the throttle and ride like a hooligan - I just know I'm going to get into trouble on this bike sooner or later, but it's so much fun. Riding the Buell can be a more rewarding and involved experience, the BMW is just highly competent and does whatever you ask with no fuss (except deep sand). I love them both for different reasons, but if I could only choose one... maybe I should put some more miles on the XB before I answer that. | ||
| Eulysses |
Thanks Mike. Not being a pirate-type guy I was closing in on a GS after a 2 year search. Adventures planned, buddies lined up...convinced the GS was the opposing choice to a hog...and more befitting for a guy who liked dual-sports. Then I rode a Uly. It was an accident. I did not even know about them...found it hiding at a Harley shop while buddy was checking out a bike. Dang! As someone who could not justify 2 bikes...it had to be the Uly. As capable in a cross-country ride as blasting a logging road (we do need thicker tires) and taking the Princess on a nice ride up 101...the Uly did it all with a real fun factor I did not get from my GS rides (ala Gambito's experience). So, that's my story on this line... | ||
| Dentguy |
Here's my problem with your resale value argument. I don't buy bikes for the resale.... Mikef5000, I wasn't trying to argue anything so please don't take that from it. I was just trying compare the resale values on approx. 2 year old bikes in relation to their MSRP's. One of them is taking a much bigger hit than the other. Since you were comparing costs, I thought it was only fair to also compare resale worth after a few years. For someone who will resale in a few years, I think that factors into cost. I compared 08's because your dad bought one. If you ride your bikes into the ground, like you say, then resale doesn't matter. You didn't mention that in your first post. Obviously the out of pocket savings will be better. But for someone who may only keep a bike for a few years, recouping more of that out of pocket money may play a factor. That was my point. As for the apples to apples. I understand comparing what is available right now, but a loaded out GS with (I assume) ABS, Computer, ESA, TPM, Alarm and whatever else vs. a Uly with bags isn't really apples to apples when talking costs. Thanks again for your write up. | ||
| Mikef5000 |
I didn't take your reply as an argument, and I hope you didn't take mine that way either. What I meant to post originally, and forgot until after the fact, was I really wanted to keep the cost out of the comparison. That's why I didn't mention it till the little 'fun fact' at the very end of the whole write-up. | ||
| Wolfridgerider |
I can't wait to hit the DIRT! | ||
| Ejbeert |
Been looking at bmw this winter as well, also came across a 950 ktm adventure; does any one have any experience with the 950 long distance, two up ? | ||
| Loves_to_ride |
Used to think about a 1200gs until a buddy and I ran across a guy on a muddy dirt road who had dumped his. Had all the bags, etc. Took all 3 of us to get it upright. I've dumped my uly a couple times and didn't have too much trouble getting it up myself. Would consider the 800gs, but don't have a local dealer. When my uly wears out I will see what is around. The KTM adv would be one choice, but you might look at the KTM sm t. It appears more like the uly and large bags are now available. | ||
| Buewulf |
does any one have any experience with the 950 long distance, two up ? Can't speak to two-up riding, but the BMW is hands down more comfortable than the KTM in a manner similar to Gambito's comparison between the BMW and the Uly. Things are happening on the KTM while things are happening around the BMW. KTM's are ridden. BMWs are piloted. Just depends what type of experience you are looking for. If you go the KTM route, look for a 990 instead of the 950. I suspect the SMT 990 would be the best two-upper KTM has to offer if you don't need the extra off-road prowess. | ||
| Bryn1203 |
when it comes to a replacement for a Uly and you want a fun bike then the new Ducati 1200 multistrada looks like it could be good. Or the moto morini granpasso or trumpet Tiger. A GS1200 is way down on my list. GS800 on the other hand looks good. I had a Beemer 1000 back in the day and never liked it. There again loads of people do like GS1200's - I guess I am missing something. | ||
| Treysmagna |
I too am pissed at Harley for what they did to Buell and went and looked at both the 1200 Adventure and the 800. I probably would have left with a bike, but they would give me zilch for my Uly in trade. Not sure what I will do in the future. Got rid of an R100GS to get the Uly. Guess I will keep the Uly a while longer, but it is getting close to time to get a new bike. | ||
| Conchop |
The new Moto Guzzi Stelvio is worth a look. They put the low rpm torque to this years model. I would like to see a comparison test with the Guzzi, gs1200, Ducati, Tiger, and the last of the 2010 Uly. Let's just see if our precious Uly's really stack up to the newest adventure touring rigs of the world. Wouldn't it be ironic if the 2010 Uly would win a comparison test. I bet the 2010 Ducati Multistrada takes the field. Too bad the 1125 Uly isn't going to be around to spar with the Ducati Multistrada. | ||
| Porky |
Athough I don't own a ULY, I'm on my 65th bike right now so I thought I'd offer an opinion. Currently I ride a new 2009 Buell 1125CR, a 2009 Yamaha T-max, a 2005 HD 883R and a 2010 Triumph Scrambler. I think the best all around bike I've ever owned was my 1999 R1100GS. It was super comfortable with excellent ergonomics. It had very usable, adequate speed and torque. Excellent ABS brakes. Superb telelever front end and paralever rear that has to be felt to be apreciated. Spot on fuel injection with excellent mileage. It was also VERY easy to work on, with the "JUGS" hanging right out in the air. It liked an occassional dirt road but was far from a real off-road worthy bike, such as my last dualsport, a 1999 KTM 640 EXC. No chain or belt to worry about was a plus even though BMW's final drives sometimes fail: Mine never did and I've had 5 BMW's. The GS line is extremely reliable too. I have never seriously thought about ULY ownership because every time I went to look at one they were never, ever discounted. I do think it would be cool to have an Adventure bike (ULY) that would sound like a hot rodded 1200 Sportster though! They are a beautiful piece of machinery! Maybe someday! Sam  | ||
| Bzrider |
i love my buell it always puts a smile on my face the pwer is a a useable rpm .but at almost 40k miles my first year i am looking for other options i rode 990 adventure .i would probably make an all right replacement if i was going to be off road more than on .i am really considering 1200 gs aventure any suggestions | ||
| Hooper |
65 bikes? Come back anytime, Porky...drop some knowledge! I'm on #4 after 5.5 years of riding. | ||
| Xbimmer |
65 bikes? Come back anytime, Porky...drop some knowledge! I'm on #4 after 5.5 years of riding. I'm on #4 after 40 years of riding... a plethora of siblings' and friends' bikes to ride in that time though. Still have 3 of the 4. | ||
| Eulysses |
Geez...I wish I still had mine...a Mountaineer (tote goat), Harley Hummer, 80 Yamaha(4),Triumph Cub, Tohatsu Runpet Sport 50, Hodaka Ace 90, 250 Yamaha, 350 Yamaha and on and on and on...love my Uly. |
