| Author | Message | ||
     Florida_lime |
I often wondered if my ECM was the problem, but I've been good since re-replacing my plugs and plug wires, along with a new ETS and BAS. No extended rides with it yet, but so far so good with the SS BS. A couple other minor issues, but I'm holding off on any judgment right now. Hopefully that does it for you -- you've had to battle it more than I have. | ||
| Maximum |
Great news Vern! I am just about ready to dig into my '06 Uly for some wire ground issues. Have you ever thought about coming out to Colorado for a "vacation"? I have a room for you (right next to the garage)! | ||
| Etennuly |
Thanks Steve! I suppose I would need to bring my painting equipment and have an extra week or so!??  Would that garage have a fridge and stock of Coors Light? | ||
| Maximum |
Anything you need my friend!!!  | ||
| Etennuly |
I'm feeling better about this situation a little more each day. One thing that it fixed was the fan. It now does like it was originally set up to do. It is no longer confused about when or how long to be on. The bike feels strong and like it runs correctly every time now, kind of like it got it's confidence back. To be sure it is really fixed though will take a year of riding to prove out. I am sure this issue will just fade out of my brain and I won't think about it anymore.....until it happens again!  This repair has the bike feeling like a lot of little things that were off just a bit, are fixed. Any of the previous times the bike felt good, strong, and the FL/R/S went away, but it never felt 'totally healed' like it does now. I have to go ride out to get a truck. When will it stop feeling like a test ride, and become just a ride again?  | ||
| Sanchez |
> What if the ECM is dying because of its location near the heat source that the BAS had to run from? One of my bugs turned out to be a bad ECM. The seat rubbed on the rear connector until it loosened the ignition lead. The effect was like flipping the kill switch off and then on while riding. I replaced the ECM and put in one of the nylon blocks that the 2007+ models came with, so hopefully it won't happen again. | ||
| Etennuly |
I was really hoping this thread could go to the archives.....but NOoooooooooooo!!!! It's BACK! The ECM made that bike run like a scalded dog....for a while. FL/R/S is back. This time it is throwing two codes. 21 and 13. And it still runs great! 21 being the muffler valve(I always wanted to say that and actually have one). 13 is the 02 sensor. I expected a code on the ETS, but not these. I am getting the RSS kit before doing any more changes. I have thoroughly investigated the muffler actuator and its function, as well as the muffler end and its cable. No problem seen there. I have to reinvestigate that damn 02 sensor wire to see if it touched anything hot again. Have you guys that replaced the ETS had any returning symptoms? Have you guys with the RSS kit had any returning symptoms? Electraglider__1997 has found something interesting. Lately his oil temperature is getting continually higher than normal. I think his Uly is on the road to our FL/R/S syndrome. He believes the fan is coming on too late, thus allowing the engine to get too hot, making it harder for the fan to get it to cool down per normal operation. Using that data with mine, and what I have found that does not help, I am thinking the ETS is loosing it's ability to cope. Worn out to an effect. When it cycles a number of times it tells the fan to come on too late, so the engine gets just a little too hot for the fan to bring it back down in time to stay cool under load. I have another theory, but it may be off the wall and hard to investigate. Could there be a collapse of a tube inside the muffler somewhere causing a restriction in exhaust flow? Do any of you guys with the symptom have and aftermarket muffler? Or are all of the problems on bikes with stock mufflers? Is it possible the valve is broken in the closed position inside the muffler allowing a lack of exhaust heat flow at load and speed?? I did clamp mine open to test, and it was louder at idle. I'm reaching out to you guys for help here!?!  | ||
| Florida_lime |
ETS was cheap -- $36 if memory serves me right. I had it changed, even if the flow chart said it was OK. 21 and 13 were my trouble codes also during the SSBS. No problems since, but several things were done at that time. No longer rides since then, and it has cooled slightly since this summer, plus I do have the RSS now.  | ||
| Xbimmer |
Mine always throws the 13 and 21 lately. The actuator works and the 02 sensor is new, so who knows. The FL/R/S scenario had stopped for a couple weeks, even on a 100 deg day two up for a quick 80 mile ride no FL/R/S. I'd changed and wiggled so much stuff I figured I'd finally got it. Until yesterday... temp in the 80's, in the mountains, pull out to pass some cars on a long straight... BAM... FL/R/S. This sucks, I don't want to shell out the $80 for a new ETS and find out it's not the problem but looks like I may have to. | ||
| Etennuly |
Interesting to see we have the same codes showing. I am ordering the comfort kit and the ETS today. I cannot believe it would still do this, showing codes, and still run great up to the problem. | ||
| Xbimmer |
I cannot believe it would still do this, showing codes, and still run great up to the problem. Exactly. I've run with an RSS for three years and there's NO way that fan should have been running yesterday as relatively cool as it was and at speed in the mountains, and when it's actually hot out or in traffic it pings but there wasn't any ping yesterday. | ||
| Etennuly |
there's NO way that fan should have been running yesterday as relatively cool The temperature was 69F when mine did it last night. What ever is causing it, the temperature that used to be a big part of the problem is becoming less relevant. | ||
| Etennuly |
I have talked it over with my brother, an electromechanical engineer type who uses thermo switches of all kinds and ranges for some of his more sophisticated automated welding and or cutting machines. He says that being a thermistor switch, if it has ever suffered a serious overheat situation, it could have altered the switch's ability to send a correct voltage signal for a given temperature to the ECM. He also said they can simply wear out from use and exposure. I am now wondering if the 21 and 13 codes are because of an imbalance of data in the ECM due to a shifted ETS reading. The ECM would recalibrate to compensate wherein nothing would line up data wise. The 02 sensor and muffler sensor could max out trying to reach calibration with the errant heat switch signal. Parts will likely be here Friday from Liberty Buell. They had the things I needed in stock! Thanks Liberty, Moose, and company! | ||
| Etennuly |
Parts came in and are in! Installed the comfort kit in less than two hours, only had to stop to answer the phone twice. Did some cleaning in there while I had the battery mount out. A dead baby mouse was found in a cleaning rag that I had always carried under the seat. They did not damage anything, more like they were toting stuff in than tearing up what was there. I did find and fix three more compromised spots in the wiring insulation. I think that makes my count nineteen. I still cannot believe it hasn't popped fuses or burned to the ground! Even more so, that it has run so well(up to FL/R/S). The ETS was easy to handle also. I cut a groove in an old 1/2" 3/8 deep socket to accommodate the wire. It worked well. The new stuff is in place. I warmed up the bike, set up the VDSTS to reset the TPS and codes. The codes were gone and the TPS settings looked good. It is TEST ride time again. Might even be smoother this time, I finally installed the front engine isolator that I bought back in March. It was time. | ||
| Florida_lime |
Damn Vern ! How do you like your new Uly ?  I hope that does it for you. | ||
| Etennuly |
I'm loving my 'new' Uly! Incredibly smooth! I ran a hundred mile loop with Orangulius today. At about forty miles out there was a three mile up hill run. I leaned on it hard the whole way up. Third, forth, and fifth gears 70 to 80. No problems, no FL/R/S. The RSS kit helps with heat management for sure. The bike's and mine. The ETS lead wire was compromised. At the point the rubber boot covers the sensor, the insulation was gone off from the sensor wire for about a quarter of an inch. The wire was not broken, and the insulation covering was still in place, not as if it had been pulled and slid up. Everytime I worked with it I was careful handling it to not stress or twist it. This whole process would have been easier if the ETS would have thrown a code that said 'look at me'. Even the flow chart curved away from the ETS being the problem. The bike showed 'false' codes on two occasions, and no codes when it should have. Perhaps I should not feed it 'Tennessee mountain spring water' when I am out of gasoline! It's brain seems a little confused.  | ||
| Xbimmer |
Jeez I hope you've solved your issue, I'm getting fed up with mine. Cut a slot into a 1/2" socket yesterday and pulled the ETS as a test run. I had several spots on the wire that had broken shielding and what the H good is that rubber boot anyway, mine was flopping around loose down in there. Did a Ohm test on the sensor in the garage which according to the chart in the OSM was fine for the ambient temp. Wrapped the wire with some high-tech tape which made the reinstall a bitch but got it all back together. Idled it in the garage at over 90 deg and it took probably ten minutes for the fan to kick on. Went for a ride today mid-80's on my shakedown route up and down the mountain and although pinging was there occasionally and the fan was cycling I got No/Zero/Nada FL/R/S. I looked at this thing for awhile trying to figure out why it costs $80...  No matter, I'm gonna flog it tomorrow for a couple hundred miles and see what happens. If it happens again I'm getting a new sensor. | ||
| Sekalilgai |
I'm loving my 'new' Uly! alright! | ||
| Etennuly |
  The wire on my ETS was here to fore undisturbed by the work I had done in that area. This insulation is missing just above the rubber boot cover thing. The wire itself is fully intact. It was never twisted, bent, or flexed in this area, and never removed from the bike(unless done at the dealer when new or while in for warranty work). Nothing was down in the area around the wire, no debris or trash, it was clean. There were no indications of a mouse being there either, droppings, nesting and such. The insulation is not falling off loose, not baked and cracking, not able to be slid on the wire. No residual pieces of the insulation were in the hole. A mystery for sure. Over three hundred fifty miles and all is well! Once again it is running great. This is the furthest in the last few months with no FL/R/S. It is feeling healed! | ||
| Xbimmer |
Knock wood... Rode about 300 miles today, although it was cooler out it wasn't that much cooler and the bike ran great. Near as I could tell the fan was only running in city traffic and at shutdown, not nearly as much as it has been. NO FL/R/S! (knock wood again...) Is it possible that simply re-insulating the ETS wire is all that it needed? I'll know soon enough, weather will be in the 90's again in a couple of days. Hope I just saved $80. | ||
| Etennuly |
Xbimmer, Look at the picture of your sensor and compare it to mine. It looks like your wire is about to loose its insulation in the same place. I wonder if that could be from the wire simply vibrating with that being where the vibration is absorbed in its first rigid spot. Ps. I think $80.20 is cheap for fixing THIS problem! | ||
| Sekalilgai |
...+1 for the Knowledge Vault! or should that be 'New Ulysses Owner Information' ? (Message edited by sekalilgai on September 14, 2009) | ||
| Xbimmer |
Ps. I think $80.20 is cheap for fixing THIS problem! Actually I agree with you there, considering the headaches of diagnosis, and what equivalent parts from another manufacturer might cost. But $80 is $80, my wife calls the Uly my "cash cow" and after tires, wheel bearings, new tools, brakes, front isolator, clutch cable and whatever else recently, another expensive-to-her part and I'd never hear the end of it. No I can't/don't have a secret stash... Personal situation aside, put another 80 miles on today in 80ish weather, bike ran great. Mostly in city traffic and stop and go, fan acted like it was controlled again. Never came on on the freeways. I knew the engine was getting hot in the traffic because of the pinging, but the fan would occasionally come on for a minute then go off. Just like it used to be a couple years ago when I first added the Crins RSS. Knock wood again, I'm happy for now, let's see what happens in a couple days when it's 90+ again. | ||
| Etennuly |
But $80 is $80, my wife calls the Uly my "cash cow" and after tires, wheel bearings, new tools, brakes, front isolator, clutch cable and whatever else recently, another expensive-to-her part Oh. That stuff counts? Odd. I have been so focused on fixing this particular problem I haven't seen the 'regular' expenses lately. I have had them though. Two tires, ECM(used) Comfort kit, ETS, Mr Bill test dummy, lots of different wraps and tape, front isolator(purchased earlier), oil filter, oil, primary oil, MP3 player/cover/wires/speakers for my helmet, spark plugs, I'm sure there is more, but now that I have listed what I can remember from lately, I feel your pain. The bigger cost for me on this issue was the time investment. An hour of permagrin has paid that part off! Several short trips now and the healing is still feeling right! | ||
| Etennuly |
Many short trips on it now. I gotta say that comfort kit is the right thing to do just from the drivers perspective. The ETS replacement is seemingly the repair that was needed. The bike feels like it did when it was new. I found myself having to ride the bike yesterday and today, as in it feels great, I know it is raining, but I had to suit up and ride it. I have not felt this way about it since it was new, heck, I want to go ride it now, but it is still raining and I have to work tomorrow. Still.....I love this stupid bike  . Anybody want to ride? | ||
| Florida_lime |
Vern, I'll take you up on that offer in a few weeks -- I'll be in Robbinsville, NC from the 10th through the 16th of October. PM me for details. | ||
| Xbimmer |
Etenn, I'm starting to become envious...  Since I taped up my ETS I've had zero FL/R/S sessions and the fan has been doing great, bike's been running great. Until a couple days ago, now the idle is jumping around when hot and occasionally surges to 1500-1800. Already replaced the intake seals with (unfortunately) stock HD items recently, if I can find some James seals looks like I'll be back in there again. If it isn't one thing... | ||
| Etennuly |
X, That is a common problem if your idle speed is set about 20 RPM too high. If it is at or just above 1050 it can 'hang' or 'float' at 1800 or so. Bringing it down to like 1025 or even 1000 can level that out. | ||
| Xbimmer |
Thanks, but I run with idle a tad under 1000. This is something new and only when it's hot but yeah I'll monkey with the adjustments first before tackling the seals again, that's a PITA. | ||
| Etennuly |
On mine and another '06 that I did TPS resets on, I actually made them run worse by doing it. Until I cleaned the throttle plate and shaft to get and absolute 0 setting, but I know you have been in there so much if it were dirty it would be cleaned off just from handling it so much. I also think that the ETS is more than a bad wire, I feel the sensor is compromised. If you ride your bike more, and things continue to fluctuate and be unstable, I would sell something to get one(a kidney, or a lot of blood, a yard sale.....there has to be something!).  Everytime I fixed something and it ran well for a while, the problem would come back as something different, except for the FL/R/S, that was constant. What I mean is, one time after running perfect until FL/R/S, it would show codes, false ones, but codes, while running poorly. The next time it would run stupid and show no codes, but run bad differently. The next time the fan seemed confused. And so on. The only code I don't recall seeing more than once it the one for the ETS. That is what I mean. The problem you are showing now may be the result of that sensor being compromised, confusing the ECM. (Message edited by etennuly on September 21, 2009) |
