| Author | Message | ||
     Nwforester |
I picked up my 08 Uly from the dealership a week + ago after they replaced the Idle Air Control Assembly. The check engine light had come on on the way the the dealership and my headlight bulbs both were out when i got there. The dealer said that they would replace the bulbs under warranty. I wired both headlights to be on when on hi beam. Picked the bike up and now they call and tell me I owe them $120 because it was not covered???? My thought is that since the IAC was going out and kept shutting off the bike that it is as likely that that issue burned the bulbs out as anything. I really do not want to get in a pissing match with them either. Thoughts? (Message edited by nwforester on May 16, 2009) | ||
| Electraglider_1997 |
Spread the grief. Either you stand up for your rights or you ask how far you should bend over. What will it be? | ||
| Court |
When you rewired the headlights you surrendered any substantive argument about having it done under warranty. That's not to say they might not but they certainly have no obligation, legal or moral, to and Buell would likely not reimburse them. Same way . . . I'm confident . . you'd see if if you were in their shoes. | ||
| Nwforester |
I have no problem paying for what I did. I guess in short my question is what caused the lights to go out, a mod that I thought had been tried and tested on this board or was it the failure of the IAC. | ||
| Greenman44 |
Nwforester, I have a question about when you told them you had done the wiring mod, when you dropped it off, when you picked it up, or did they find it out on their own? If you told them when you dropped it off, and they still said they would do it under warranty I don't think your responsible for the fees. If you told them when you picked it up then I believe you could be responsible. If they found out for them self and still did the services without asking you with a quick call then I believe they are responsible for performing a service knowing it wasn't under warranty now that they had found out new information. Let me/us know I'm interested in the outcome. Shawn | ||
| Nwforester |
I fully disclosed when I dropped it off that I had done the headlight mod. They did not have an issue with it until evidently Buell told them they would not cover the replacement. | ||
| Greenman44 |
I think they should have stopped doing it at that point, or called you and stated the situation had changed. 120 buck for $20 worth of bulbs and 15 minutes of labor. I think its pretty ridiculous to me. | ||
| Nwforester |
I am all thumbs and I too can do a bulb change in 15 min, they want half an hour and full price 50+ $ for bulbs. I know how the conversation is going to go when I get to the dealership - I still have 1.8 years of warranty left so I will try and temper myself. Do not want them spitting on my Uly when I bring it in again. | ||
| Greenman44 |
Just hose it off when ya get it back from them next time... Seriously I know what your saying, but they cannot expect to pay for that when they told you it would be covered. I just don't think thats right. | ||
| Ft_bstrd |
Offer to split the cost with them. What is continued good will worth? | ||
| Xbswede |
NWforester try talking to Dave and see if he can help you out. I don't see why they wouldn't cover the bulb if they originally told you they would under warranty. | ||
| Court |
I'd suspect there is a middle ground and that a civil conversation may benefit both you and the dealer. One thing to be mindful of is that the time charged may not exactly emulate the "clock time". In other words a dealer may have a minimum 30 minutes or something. In some cases a task that is billed 30 minutes may actually only take 29 minutes or 4 minutes. But any business has to allocate non-productive time such as bathroom breaks, the time the tech has to stop what he/she is doing and go to parts to look up, get and retrieve the part. In construction, we add something like 15% "NPL" (non-productive labor) to a job to allow for the time to get started in the morning, coffee breaks, safety meetings and so forth. The "you are responsible" is not a cut and dry, black and white either. It's kinda like "you were messing around with the wiring in the area so you are presumed, absent evidence to the contrary, to be the proximate cause? This is where some dialogue and discussion with your dealer will prove valuable. HINT: Try framing this (since we're only talking about $120) a bit differently. When you talk to your dealer make your goals . . . to 1) result in the best possible relationship going forward with the dealer and 2) being as honest and fair as possible. See where that leads. Court | ||
| Xbswede |
Not to mention this dealer has a minimum of 1/2 hr labor charge. Either case I have had good success with this dealer. If you follow Courts advise I am sure you can get something worked out. Let me know as well. A few of us locals have an interest here as well. | ||
| Panhead_dan |
There may be another angle.... Why were both bulbs out? Did they both go out at nearly the same time? The reason I ask is because both bulbs out could be a symptom of a voltage regulator overcharging. This, if the case, kinda puts a whole new light on it. (pun intended) If I was you, I would check the charging system myself so that I knew where I stood and if there was a problem with it I would go back and politely suggest that they missed something. Hopefully a warrenty something. A longshot yes but ya never know. With my luck it would result in a $500 dollar charge for charging sys parts as a result of the headlight mod. | ||
| Teeps |
My experiences have shown that incandescent light bulbs fail for several reasons: 1)the filament is consumed, as in normal wear and tear of operation. 2)the operating voltage was higher than the design spec. In which case ALL incandescent bulbs would fail. 3)the filament broke due to fatigue from vibration or other gforce load (like slamming the front end down from a wheelie that got away.) 4)low quality bulbs (see #1 & #3) can be added to the list, when speaking about "premature" or reoccurring bulb failures. Don't see how wiring both bulbs, to be on together, either in series or parallel would cause a simultaneous filament failure. This case should probably be added to the "it! happens" column, and just move on. If you can negotiate a better settlement; then good on you. | ||
| Od_cleaver |
Panhead Dan has given you some good advice. If you read any threads on charging system failures, you will find some guys complaining about burned out head lamps. The voltage regulator went and so went the headlight. Without a regulator you get max stator voltage to the battery and the rest of the electrical circuit. This is a real good reason to add a voltmeter to that bike. | ||
| Choyashi |
Just pay them or they might go belly up! Their sales are probably way down and they need every cent they can to stay afloat. They have already blown all the money they made gouging people on Harleys when times were good. They've been blindsided like all of us. This is a "Depression", be glad you have your family and health! P.S. Never alter your bike until the warranty is out!! Unless your wealthy!!! Also, "Warranties are what dealers use to get you to buy something, they are beting nothing goes wrong, just like you! When it does, the first "why?" is did the customer mess with it! (Message edited by choyashi on May 17, 2009) (Message edited by choyashi on May 17, 2009) | ||
| Froggy |
I had no issues getting a fuel pump warrantied on my Lightning  | ||
| Nwforester |
Froggy - Nothing modified that I can see!  Nice! I do not think I will wait 2 years with a stock Uly. The list is growing daily. Yes HD gave their customers exactly what they wanted the last few years, no fault in that - it is called good business. They just went along with the materialistic frenzy this country was engaged in. Thanks for the advice on the voltage regulator. | ||
| Thumper74 |
Thats a Lightning?! | ||
| Froggy |
A long time ago in a driveway not that far away:  | ||
| Tootal |
+1 on the VR but also check the stator. I changed the VR and ruined it, and two more bulbs, because the real problem was the stator. Your mod did not cause the problem. | ||
| Reepicheep |
Heat kills electrics, and your modification is pumping twice the heat into that enclosure over stock. Thats a lot of watts in a little plastic housing. | ||
| Thunderbox |
The only fault with that reasoning is both lights are in separate enclosures and one being on has no effect on the other. I did my mod long ago and have never had an issue nor has anyone else. This is just a poor decission by this dealer and it will probably cost him way more than he can ever know. Bad business decission for sure. | ||
| Rwven |
The same lamp in housings 1/2 that size last just fine. $120.00 to replace 2 lamps that cost $8.00 each at WalMart is highway robbery as is having a verbal agreement that a repair is to be covered by warranty and not informing the customer prior to performing the work that the warranty was voided. | ||
| Greenman44 |
I agree... work should never have stopped upon determining warranty was no longer going to cover it until getting the approval to do the work. I can see how you may not want to burn bridges with a dealership, but I think its ridiculous. The option to have the work performed should have been given.. that's really what I see is wrong with the situation. | ||
| Reepicheep |
The housings aren't *that* separate, and size of the enclosure is less important then the thermal properties of the assembly. If you want to model it, you can do a rough approximation using Ohms law, treating the thermal resistance like electrical resistance. That has worked for me when I designed heat sinks. A mm of plastic can insulate better then a foot of aluminum. My tail light went out while my bike was under warranty. I pulled into Auto Zone on the way home and replaced it. I bet a short polite conversation with the dealer would work it out quickly. If not, $120 is a cheap way to learn to do your own work whenever possible... it cost me $600 when I learned that lesson on a 1981 Honda Prelude. That one taught me a lesson about going "low bid" on mechanics as well, but that's another thread for another day. | ||
| Nwforester |
Ok - went in today and settled this, they essentially split the bill, they dropped the installation charge and I paid for the bulbs. Latus is one of the best Buell dealerships in the country, I understand when Buell tries and stick them with something that Latus thought would be covered. I Just made sure that in the future if they have something they are unsure of I want to know. Even I can change a light bulb. Thanks for all the responses. | ||
| Panhead_dan |
I agree about Latus being a good dealership. I buy most of my parts and stuff from them even though I could shop closer. Always a pleasant experience. I recently had a good experience from yet another dealership. I need a battery for my Uly and will be leaving in the morning for a week. Just so happens I'll be near Cascade HD in Bend so I call them. Two in stock (they are are quite rare locally along with clutch levers and oil filters)and got a price and paid it on the spot for 89.95. | ||
| Petereid |
Don't feel too bad. I had a $180 bill from my dealer to fix an electrical short caused by another dealer who had disconnected my lights from my alarm when they swapped rear turn signals. Long story short, sometimes they would ground out and i would loose turn signals. Warranty didn't cover it because it was an aftermarket (Viper) alarm that was not dealer installed. The way I look at it the dealer who fixed it isn't the one responsible for causing it so they should get paid. They offered to adjust the bill and contact the other dealer to try and get something back from them for me. I told them not to worry about it. I bought a second bike from them 2 weeks later and was "rewarded" for my understanding. Moral of this story: Get all your work done at the same dealer when ever possible.Build a relationship with your dealer it will pay off. | ||
| Greenman44 |
Well I'm glad to see that they worked with you about the labor. I think I personally will take into account than when I'm having work done if anything else comes up during the work they are doing to let me know so I don't get any surprises like you did. I agree it is good to build a relationship with your dealer because they could hook you up someday or totally screw ya over. |
