| Author | Message | ||
     Beaglecycle |
I went to a BMW dealer today to get a part for a buddies bike, and I looked at the GS. 3 things stood out: 1 damn are these things tall. 2 4g more, 3 ABS optional? What are the pros and cons. My current bike has abs, and I never really thought about it until now. It's not a deal breaker, but then again, does it make a big difference? | ||
| Dick8008 |
I'm keeping my fingers crossed for ABS for Buell's entire line up. It's an option that I feel is well worth the money. We all have it on our cars now and don't think about it. Would you buy a car with out ABS or airbags? Something you have and hope never to need. I could do with out that option of hitting the front brake and having it applied to both front and back. My understanding is if you hit 20% front brake and 505 on the back you'd actually be getting 70% on the back. In a panic situation that could be trouble. Also could get ya lazy.... | ||
| Thespive |
I would certainly buy a vehicle without ABS and airbags, especially a 4x4. ABS makes stoping longer and more dangerous in the dirt and we have had airbags go off several times while testing vehicles. I personally don't want ABS on my bike, either. Don't mind it in the family hauler, though. --Sean | ||
| Rubberdown |
I love Switchable ABS. Use it when you want and switch it off when you don't; in the dirt or at the track. | ||
| Harleychanic |
Not a fan of ABS on Bikes, either Bmw's or Harleys ABS, they both are disconserting on a motorcycle especially when you are trying to lock the backend up to slide around and immobile object!! | ||
| Jlnance |
We all have it on our cars now and don't think about it. Would you buy a car with out ABS or airbags? I haven't got it on mine, but it's 10 years old. Does it come on all cars now? I remember it being popular in the early 90s and then seemed to fall out of favor. I really haven't looked at a new car in years. Someone pointed out to me once that NASCAR cars don't have ABS (I'm assuming thats true.) The reason being that they are operated by professional drivers and ABS just gets in their way. Passenger cars are in general not operated by skilled drivers, and ABS helps. So where does that leave bikes? We like to think we are more skilled than car drives. Thats probably true. Whether we are skilled enough to outbrake an ABS system, I don't know. I used to practice braking hard enough to lock the tires and then backing off to unlock the wheels. I haven't done it in a while. Hopefully I still can.  | ||
| Erz |
Used to own a BMW that had ABS. It saved my ass one night when a family of deer were strung out across a turn I had just come flying around. Without it that night I would have skidded the bike because I grabbed all the brake I could, figuring if I was going to hit something I might like to be going slower, when i hit it. Avoided everything, thank god. I sold that bike and bought a ULY. The Uly is WAAAAAAYYYY more fun to ride but wish I had ABS. I would buy ABS as an option if I could. | ||
| Brad1445 |
I have it on my Triumph, I love it. I say its worth it | ||
| M2nc |
ABS would have saved me. I want it. | ||
| Bearly |
IMHO, no traction control, wheelie control or ABS. How on earth could one be a hooligan? | ||
| Bigdaddy |
My primary 4-wheel ride doesn't even have seat belts, but it will have A/C someday soon | ||
| Paochow |
I have it on my KTM990 and am learning to like it. In the dirt, the rear brake is lacking with ABS as it won't let it lock, but I find I can hammer the front brake without worrying, which actually shortens my stopping distance. I can switch it off with the push of a button, but generally leave it on. | ||
| Chas1969 |
A Big Yes, but switchable (on/off), little extra weight, extremely reliable and cheap .... I know dream on. LOL Chas | ||
| Strokizator |
Boy do I wish my Uly had ABS. It probably wouldn't have stopped me before I hit the guy who made a u-turn out of nowhere but it would have kept me from being fly-swatted into the pavement and really screwing up my arm. My new Road Glide has it and combined with the Brembo brakes is a very nice set-up. Of course, on an "adventure" bike you would want to be able to switch it off. | ||
| Bertotti |
If my bike had abs it would be the first thing I removed but the odds that i would buy one with abs are very very slim. I don't want it on a bike! | ||
| Old_mil |
I don't think ABS is worth it. The system adds weight and complexity. It can also add to braking distances under certain conditions. Finally, if you look at the numbers from an IBMWR article (pro BMW, and so pro ABS), they're far from earth shattering when tested under the conditions in which motorcycles commonly operate. In fact, if you're getting on your binders to keep from hitting granny in her Buick who pulled out in front of you, you're better off without it. Figure 2. Comparative Braking Distances by Motorcycle (Average of Five Passes on Dry Pavement) Expert rider, all distances from 60 mph BMW (non-ABS model) 153 ft Full ABS Control 162 ft ABS disabled 155 ft Honda (non-ABS model) 149 ft Full ABS Control 156 ft ABS disabled 150 ft Yamaha (non-ABS model) 148 ft Full ABS Control 152 ft ABS disabled 148 ft BMW's ABS adds $1000 and 20 pounds to a 1200GS. There was quite a bit of concern developing over the BMW ABS system failing and leaving the rider with only residual brakes when the bike encountered certain surfaces (http://www.bmw-bike-forum.info/k1200lt/viewtopic.php?t=1749&start=51 For those of you who don't read German, "My servo failed many times and most of them I could't note the ABS lights blinking." Gildo G "280 miles from last failure/ABS module replacement similar circumstance same failure, no rear brake, "Light switch" front, Servos screaming all the time, Dealer brought the trailer" UtahDirt Now - look what i found here: sure there have been a few problems with the 1200GS, including final drive failures (mine included) The ABS went out on my dealers demo 12GS and it took them almost a month to get it fixed. They apparently experienced some sort of complete break failure that freaked them so much they lose trust in the GS. A friends 12GS had intermittent ABS and Servo failure (hardly worked) about a week ago in the middle of Oz. Had to take it all the way to Adelaide to get fixed. I have had several occasions where I apply the brakes and I find for a split second they're not there. It's weird, it's as if I almost feel like I am surging forward before slowing down). They were redesigned with the 07 BMWs; it remains to be seen if this solved the problem. Honda's, $1900 and 11 pounds to an ST1300. Naturally, responsible riders are concerned about the level of safety they have when engaging in the sport they love. I just don't think ABS is the unquestioned benefit in motorcycles that it is in cars. I like my non ABS Buell just fine. (Message edited by Old_Mil on October 05, 2007) (Message edited by Old_Mil on October 05, 2007) | ||
| Rubberdown |
Switchable ABS on the R1200S BMW is 3.3 lbs. Their new ABS system is very nice with very good feel. The residual brake thing is in the past as the power servo system is no longer used (maybe on the Lt). I had it on an R1200ST and it worked fine but I like the new system much better. | ||
| Electraglider_1997 |
Airbags on bikes and ABS on bikes goes against the Buell mantra of simplification. Given the choice, I personally would not opt for ABS on a motorcycle. When I grab for brakes I want them to do exactly what I intend them to do, not what some computer chip and servo mechanisms cause them to do. | ||
| Rubberdown |
I see the new Buell slipper clutch much like the ABS in that it's a device, primarily controlled by the machine, that prevents the wheel from locking when you don't want it to. I've ridden the 1125 and I like the slipper and I don't think that it detracts from the essence of riding. | ||
| Garry |
How many crashes do you read about due to the rider locking either the front or rear brake while panic braking and crashing before ever hitting the thing they're trying to avoid? Lots. The "I had to lay 'er down" story. No, your emergency braking skills were not up to the task at hand. Too much too soon on the front brake when that deer jumps out, or the left-turner violates your right-of-way and you're surfing asphalt. It's the panic aspect that is missing from the braking tests. Many/most experienced riders can do a fine emergency stop on clean dry pavement when they are practicing. I've seen experienced racers tuck the front on the street due to a deer causing them to panic and grab too much, too soon. In braking tests I've read comparing identical model bikes that come with and without ABS, ABS blows away non-ABS stopping distances in the wet. If you never ride in the wet or otherwise reduced traction conditions (cold tires, slightly dusty, tar snakes, painted lines, tiny gravel or sand, etc), or are willing to assume you'll never panic when an emergency braking situation arises, then ABS might not be for you. IMO, it's a fine option to have for the rest of us mortals that ride in the real world... (Message edited by garry on October 05, 2007) | ||
| Tootal |
There have been a lot of people on this site and others wanting more on their Uly's. All of this stuff, fuel gauge, abs, self canceling turn signals etc. all come with the price of weight and cost. I think Buell thinks a lot about weight in their designs and that's probably one reason they don't put all that stuff on there. A BMW GS has all that stuff but it weighs a lot more too. Everything is a compromise. If they had all that stuff then we would be complaining about it's weight.  | ||
| Bake |
I just bought a 1200 GS with ABS and like it a lot more than I thought I would. It's kinda fun to hammer the front brake to the bar and let the ABS do it's thing (well so far I only did that once on a test ride) but isn't that what we are supposed to do on a test ride? I think it's one of them things you may really wish you had one day. | ||
| Daves |
No thanks. | ||
| Danger_dave |
I don't want it on my Uly. I take stuff OFF my Uly. I liked ABS on the Kawasaki Concours 1400. | ||
| Ratbuell |
The one aspect I haven't seen mentioned on here is right on the HD DVD that comes with every ABS bike for 2008. Bike ABS is a straight line system. Period. You can not hammer ABS in a turn, it will stand the bike up and you'll go straight. In a right turn / bend situation, that puts you right into oncoming traffic. You cannot use ABS on a bike if you are sliding on gravel - it controls forward (tire rotational) lockup only, lateral slides are lateral slides. You do not get the "stomp n steer" effect you get in a car. I know I 'interact' more with my bikes than I do with my cars; in the car I'm along for the ride and listening to tunes, on the bike I'm an active participant. I log over 20k a year between my bikes and thru paying attention ALL the time, I have yet to experience an unexpected "he pulled out in front of me" panic situation - and I commute to work on a bike every day in addition to pleasure rides. Sure, folks have pulled out in front of me - happens every time I pull out of the garage and ride the bike. But I see it coming before it's "too late". I'm sure someday I won't, but so far so good, and I'll pass on the $800 HD system and would probably pass on it if Buell offered it. Nothing against the concept or the benefits on a cage...but it's just not for me on a bike. And yes, I've ridden ABS bikes. Neat...but not $800+ neat...and not something I want to put my trust in when it comes down to the wire. I'd rather trust my hand, foot, and brain (compromised as that last one may be, LOL). | ||
| Electraglider_1997 |
Ratbuell, Exactly! | ||
| Bigkuri |
Oh god, What is it about ABS posts and my inability to keep quiet?... Hate it. ...And...I do... hate ABS... I also often get flamed by other forums that think that taking a non-ABS bike on the street is paramount to being killed. It's complex. It involves computers. It adds weight. And no, bikes should not be like a BMW 5 series (which I own and love). Its a bike goddam it! Why have the safest bike money can buy? Go by a GS! Huge dirt bike, big front wheel, and ABS by default (yes you can switch it on and off, but who does?) I agree with Ratbuell in every single way, even more so as ABS is just that much closer to non-real biking.... | ||
| Ratbuell |
I don't even equate / judge it as being "non-real" biking; that has so many different definitions to so many people. For me, biking is getting away from people in general (whom I generally don't like) and pushing my adrenaline button a bit where there are no witnesses, lol. To other people it's all about the socialization - meet up with a group, ride a few miles, stop for chow or a beer, hit the store and buy a tee shirt, ride a bit more, go home with time to wax and buff the bike before sundown. That's cool...for them, and I'm sure they have the same opinion of my "riding style". And its not a lack of trust in technology on my part either. My main objection is to complacency. I used to work for Jeep, and too many times we'd get the typical suburban houseperson (wife/husband, it's all the same) stating quite matter-of-factly that "I should NOT have gone into the ditch in the snow and ice because I have 4 wheel drive". The best was the hydrolocked motor in a Grand Cherokee that "should have been warranty" because the truck was "trail rated"...never mind it was a four foot deep river they tried to cross. Duh. Technology does not replace common sense (although sometimes it does tend to negate it). ABS (or 4 wheel drive, for that matter) does not bend the laws of physics. ABS can help braking stability under *certain* conditions, just as 4 wheel drive can help you gain traction for *acceleration* on compromised surfaces...neither is a magic wand or a teleporter, and my passive amateur observation of the human condition in today's society tells me that putting this technology in a bike, without proper education as to its true effects and shortcomings (and kudos to HD for providing that DVD to all ABS buyers, I stress to every buyer that they *must* watch it at least once)....is asking for trouble. Hot McDonald's coffee anyone? Me? I'll keep paying enough attention for me, and the other guy, and the guy behind him...and come home from every ride tired, mentally spent, happy...and with 10 fingers, 10 toes, and all paint still attached to my bike |
