| Author | Message | ||
     Johnny_uly |
Okay, so my brother just spent a ton of money on a 2008 Uly (and accessories) and it has died with around 50 miles on it. Here is the email he sent to me (expletives removed...): "*&@$! The damn thing stalled on me like it was out of gas and the low fuel light came on. It has a full tank! Now it won't start and the dealer can't get to it until Tuesday. The sales guy who races Buells is pissed that they turned me away and called the owner of the dealership. Owner is on vacation this weekend because, oh yea, its !*#@ing Labor Day on Monday. Meanwhile, assholes that showed up and wanted new pipes put on their Harley are getting serviced and I have to wait. $14K and 50 miles and I am not a priority? As I am writing this I am pissing myself off and am going to call the dealership back. This is *$@#ed up." Has anyone heard of this happening on an 08? This is a sad day for Buell... I am the one who convinced him to purchase it too. I am in the process of purchasing one as well -- already have financing and locked in. Any factory help would be appreciated. Help restore some faith in this brand new motorcycle and company. | ||
| Alchemy |
I hope the dealer used fresh gas when filling it up. Sounds more like a short in the fuel pump area however. Be advised that I am an idiot with this stuff but that seems to be a good place to start looking. Fuel light would not stall it but it could be related to a wiring problem. Murphy's law requires that anyone that is fortunate enough to get a new 08 Uly right before a 3 day weekend will have some stumble. It surely must be frustrating but it will get fixed. | ||
| Jb2607 |
Good luck... "stepchild" is accurate at a lot of dealerships. I too just bought an 08 Uly. I also have concerns, but nothing like yours. I am up to 470 miles on it and slowly starting to get into a moderate RPM range. Steadily over 4 grand now, but still haven't touch 5 grand yet. My guess is that it is something simple... (hopefully) JB | ||
| Etennuly |
I'm sure a lot of people would like to help you, but the changes to the '08 have made the problems different than anything we have seen on the '06 and'07's. Keep posting though, that is how the BadWeb works. | ||
| Johnny_uly |
I don't believe any of the changes on the 08s would make that much of a difference... I could be wrong though. Is there maybe something the dealer forgot to do to prep the bike? | ||
| Froggy |
Well the 08's have a totally new fuel injection system and ECM. I'm not a tech so i can't say what it is, but odds are its related to the new fuel injection. Gonna have a few kinks here and there that need to be worked out in the first few batches. | ||
| Johnny_uly |
Something is happening... Stay tuned... | ||
| Chris_socal |
All. I am Johnny_Uly's brother. Check out the thread that I started regarding the customer service experience from HD. http://www.badweatherbikers.com/buell/messages/142 838/303623.html?1188694981 Please read and reply if you have an experiences to relate. I am off to Hooters for a beer since I have no bike.  | ||
| Davo |
Chris, Does the fuel light ever go off? What about the engine light? Check fuses, relays and battery terminals then try to pull some trouble codes. Here is a procedure I used on my 06. Keep us posted on Badweb regarding your results. In order to retrieve trouble codes w/o software: Get a short piece of 18 ga. wire about 12” long with two small insulated alligator clips. The manual uses part number 72191-94 (two of them) as end connectors instead of the alligator clips. Go to the data link connector that is located on the left side just under the edge of the seat. Remove the rubber insert. There are four pins inside. Looking at the connector with the locking hasp pointed down. The pin orientation is such that pin # 1 and pin #2 are both on your left. See below: #2 #3 #1 #4 lock With the key and ignition off, connect pin #1 and pin #2 with the home made jumper. Make sure you do not touch the other pins! Then turn the key and the ignition on. Do not start the bike. The engine light should start to flash: If it flashes many times (about 10 or 11, to fast to count for me) very fast, then there are NO trouble codes. Otherwise there will be 6 quick flashes at 3 per second and this is an intermission. Then there will be a 2 second pause Then count the number of one second flashes separated by 1 second pauses and this will be your first digit. Then there will be a 2 second pause Then count the number of one second flashes separated by 1 second pauses and this will be your second digit. Then there will be a 2 second pause Start back at intermission of 6 flashes…………..and so on…….. This will continue until you turn off the ignition and the key and remove the jumper. If you remove the jumper without turning off the ignition the engine light will continue to cycle trouble codes. If you have a trouble code and then you correct the problem that created the code. The bike will automatically clear the codes after 50 start and run sessions of at least 30 seconds or more. Until then the code will remain even if the problem is fixed. Trouble code list: 11-TPS 13- O2 sensor 14-ET (engine temp) 15-air intake temp 16-battery voltage 21-exhaust actuator 23-front injector 24-front coil 25-rear coil 32-rear injector 33-fuel pump 35-tach 36-fan 44-bank angle sensor 52, 53, 54, 55- ECM failure 56-cam sync. Failure Good luck. There is a more detailed account of this procedure in the shop manual. There is also flow charts to correct all of the fault conditions. This procedure has pulled codes that my VDSTS Pro USA did not pull. The VDSTS could clear them but it could not recognize all of them. I never leave home without my jumper wire, list of the codes, small box of fuses, electrical tape, and an extra relay. I hope this helps! | ||
| Davo |
One more thing to check; put the bike in high gear and turn on the key and the ignition switch. Push the bike slowly and listen for the fuel pump to cycle. The pump should also cycle when the ignition is first turned on. If you can't hear the pump check the connector on the lower rear left side of the frame above the oil fill area. (Message edited by davo on September 01, 2007) (Message edited by davo on September 01, 2007) | ||
| Dynasport |
My only advice is since this is a brand new bike, I wouldn't do too much to it. I'd make sure the dealer took care of whatever is wrong. Beyond basic checks, I wouldn't want to do anything a dealer could claim caused the problem and not want to cover it under warrranty. Of course, if you really know what you are doing, that is a different story. I don't. | ||
| Chris_socal |
I am all for tinkering with things but as dynasport said I don't want to do anything to the bike that will void my warranty. Great post davo! I will perform the visual inspections and attempt the high gear trick you have recommended but it is too new of a bike for me to tinker around with the electrical system. | ||
| Chris_socal |
The fuel light never goes off. Engine light does goes off after a second or two. Fuses were the first thing that I checked but I will check again (sanity) in the morning. Thanks for the post. | ||
| Davo |
I need a little help with this one from a Badweber with a wiring schematic. Mine went with my bike. I can't remember if the fuel light circuit was identified other than the instrument cluster. Could someone post exactly where all of the pump wires go, ie. the ECM, ground, light or cluster? Let's get this bike on the road! | ||
| Firstbatch |
The fuel pump output wire is BN/Y and runs from the ECM to the fuel pump. The low fuel indicator light wire is Y/R and runs from the instrument cluster to the fuel pump. This info from 2006 manual so don't know for usre the wiring changes on a 2008. (Message edited by firstbatch on September 02, 2007) | ||
| Davo |
Firstbatch, Thanks for the info. Chris, I would look very closely at that wire harness for a crushed wiring harness between the pump and the ECM. Current bound for the fuel pump might be redirected to the low fuel light if there was a short between the wires. The problem might be internal, inside the tank. There have been reports of problems between the pump and the port where the wires enter the frames tank. I would definitely do a wiggle test at the point that the wires enter the tank. Can you hear the pump at all? Keep us posted. | ||
| Etennuly |
Would it be possible the Buell engineers over looked the battery bolt problem? Grab your cables, see if you can wiggle them, if so put a washer on the bolt to keep it from bottoming out. They have to be tight. | ||
| Sparky |
Another wire to the fuel pump is the gray wire which is switched +12 VDC from the ignition relay. The fourth wire is a black ground wire. This is per a '03 XB9R FSM. Since you checked the fuses, it wouldn't hurt to pull and reseat the relays. There should be 3 of them in the relay center and they should be interchangeable, if this is unchanged with the '08s. Does it crank but not fire? | ||
| Chris_socal |
OK. So I tried the non-intrusive suggestions here and nothing worked. I did however observe some behavior that is leading me to believe that there is a problem with the ecm. Over the last couple days of trying to crank the bike the battery has been taking a beating. The last couple of times I tried cranking the bike the battery was so low that the system would reset as soon as I hit the starter. When that happens the fuel light goes out. If I let the bike sit the light will come back on after a few seconds. This leads me to it either being the sensor or the ecm. I am going with ecm because the low fuel sensor can be triggered all day and it should not affect the bike running provided there is fuel making it into the system. I listen for the fuel pump when I turn the key and I don't hear anything. That could be from the battery being too low, the pump being dead, or the ecm gone bad. If it is the pump gone bad would that trigger the low fuel light? I would not think that it would, which brings me back to the ecm. Tuesday seems like a long time from now. | ||
| Curtyd |
Charge the battery and try again, I learned the hard way about that attempting to bump start my 350cc Jawa for about 2 months in France a couple of decades ago....  | ||
| Sparky |
I believe that some clues for what the ECM thinks is happening lies in retrieving the error codes. These codes are stored in EEPROM in the ECM, I believe, and are not dependant on battery condition. It would be worthwhile to take Davo's advice, make a jumper and find out what, if any, error codes your bike may have recorded in this incident. If nothing else, they might confirm your suspicions or point you in a new direction for resolution, without having to depend on the dealer's chrome-hanger service dept. You can't void a warranty just by looking at things. | ||
| Davo |
Chris, I am going out on a limb with the wiring harness between the fuel pump and the ECM. IF the pump is not working and the fuel light is on then you have two faults in the exact location and the pump not working would cause your problem. Someone in your neighborhood must have a VDSTS if you do not want to check for codes manually. Maybe they will chime in. I am a little too far East or I would be there. | ||
| Bertotti |
Will the software work with the 08 ecm? | ||
| Davo |
Bertotti, I do not know for sure but I know that the manual method to pull codes is the same as my 03 Delphi EFI system on my Ultra. The codes are different. If the plug is similar I would think it would pull the codes. | ||
| Treadmarks |
Charge the battery. Make sure the battery terminals are clean and tight. Get your hands on a service manual or take it to the dealer and with a stern voice add "or else". | ||
| Court |
What did BUELL CUSTOMER SERVICE say? | ||
| Thespive |
Buell Customer Care, the only number you NEED to know... 414-343-8400 --Sean | ||
| Chris_socal |
I am assuming that customer care is closed on Monday but I will give it a try. I think I am done trying to screw around with the bike at this point. We will see what happens with the dealer on Tuesday. I hope that they come through for me and the Buell brand. I am trying to stay positive about the situation and I hope that my attitude will help facilitate this process along. We shall see. | ||
| Tdiddy |
Don't give up. When this is resolved, you WILL love your new bike. Buell Customer Care will take great care of you. | ||
| Court |
Chris: Call BUELL CUSTOMER SERVICE 414-343-8400 on Tuesday. They will be expecting your call. If you want to send me your VIN and a history/description of the problem I can send it ahead. They open at 9:00AM Central. I suspect you'll be impressed. These guys (and gals) are very good. Court |
