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Plowman
Posted on Wednesday, December 06, 2006 - 06:03 pm:   Edit Post Delete Post View Post/Check IP Print Post    Move Post (Custodian/Admin Only) Ban Poster IP (Custodian/Admin only)

I'm looking at picking up a new bike and have about 12g to work with. I like the Uly, and am also looking at the tiger and capo. The uly has more character and style, but the other 2 have abs. I plan to spend 99% of my time on paved roads. How important is abs???
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Chadhargis
Posted on Wednesday, December 06, 2006 - 06:29 pm:   Edit Post Delete Post View Post/Check IP Print Post    Move Post (Custodian/Admin Only) Ban Poster IP (Custodian/Admin only)

That's a tough question. There was a time when I'd have told you that I wouldn't own a bike without them. Now, I wouldn't say that.

No question that it gives you a lot of confidence when applying the brakes. Nice knowing that no matter how hamfisted you are, you aren't going to lock the brakes. But they aren't a cure all. On bumpy roads, you will find your braking force severly limited of you wheels start hopping under braking. The ABS will "let go" and you'll mess your pants. They also can't keep you from over braking in turns. You can loose traction long before lockup if you are leaned over.

No doubt, they save lives. Just like airbags, but since there is only one bike with an airbag, I guess I do without.
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Ft_bstrd
Posted on Wednesday, December 06, 2006 - 07:41 pm:   Edit Post Delete Post View Post/Check IP Print Post    Move Post (Custodian/Admin Only) Ban Poster IP (Custodian/Admin only)

I don't know how I would feel about a bike with ABS. I've never riden one with them. One of my biggest fears is tucking the front end and low siding.

I don't know that ABS would help that given ice, wet, oily, or gravely roads.

I've slid in my car with ABS on wet and icy roads. It doesn't make you bullet proof.

I just don't know. It must be good. Everyone has it/wants it.

(Message edited by ft_bstrd on December 06, 2006)
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Plowman
Posted on Wednesday, December 06, 2006 - 08:04 pm:   Edit Post Delete Post View Post/Check IP Print Post    Move Post (Custodian/Admin Only) Ban Poster IP (Custodian/Admin only)

I laid down a bike a while ago when a nut came off my riser and locked my forks. I had to lock it up and laid it down, narrowly missing a tree. I'm not sure if abs would have kept me up, but it did scare the hell out of me. That's part of why I'm looking for abs, the reason I want a new bike is because I have lost faith in my 1/2 ton cruiser.
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Krassh
Posted on Wednesday, December 06, 2006 - 08:25 pm:   Edit Post Delete Post View Post/Check IP Print Post    Move Post (Custodian/Admin Only) Ban Poster IP (Custodian/Admin only)

My 1993 Yamaha GTS1000 has ABS and I love it, but the brakes on the Buell are superior to most non-ABS bikes I have had the pleasure to ride. The ABS definitely takes the guess work most of the times out of panic braking. I have had a car pull out in front of me while going faster than I should and the ABS was nice. If a bike I was looking at had an ABS option, it was a reliable system and it was in my price range I would get the option. I do not think it would be a deciding factor for me on a choice between 2 bikes though. My 2 cents for what it is worth.
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Imonabuss
Posted on Wednesday, December 06, 2006 - 09:53 pm:   Edit Post Delete Post View Post/Check IP Print Post    Move Post (Custodian/Admin Only) Ban Poster IP (Custodian/Admin only)

Wow, having your front end lock up must have been one scary experience. Glad you came out OK and ready to ride again! ABS could be really cool, but I have been disappointed with every system I have ridden to date. The comments from Chad and FtB are right on target, and make me feel that motorcycle ABS is not perfected yet. When a system is developed that doesn't get confused by bumps, dirt on roads and corners, then I think I'll be on board. But until then, I'll just try to stay attentive, since that's the one place ABS could be a benefit now.
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Lorazepam
Posted on Wednesday, December 06, 2006 - 10:35 pm:   Edit Post Delete Post View Post/Check IP Print Post    Move Post (Custodian/Admin Only) Ban Poster IP (Custodian/Admin only)

I left BMW abs because the brakes failed to a weak manual (not much) in the even of a servo failure.

I dont think I can lock the Uly rear up, and I dont care for linked brakes, which a lot of abs systems have.

I have been happy with the Uly brakes so far, but a downhill 2 up with loaded bags became a thrill for a second or two, I think I found the limit for the brakes on that one.
I weigh as much as half you guys two up I am willing to bet.



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Red_chili
Posted on Thursday, December 07, 2006 - 09:26 am:   Edit Post Delete Post View Post/Check IP Print Post    Move Post (Custodian/Admin Only) Ban Poster IP (Custodian/Admin only)

The only bike I've owned with ABS was an 1150GS. The first time I hit gravel I soiled myself - NO BRAKES! I nearly nailed our dumpster at the end of the driveway (dumpsters do not make very good berms). Sliding using the brake is part of my riding. I found it a real pain to disable too.

That cured me of the desire. Just does not work for my preferred riding style, YMMV. I didn 't feel like relearning a whole new style.

Go take a MSF advanced course or equivalent somewhere and practice incipient lockup of the front wheel. Go get/borrow a dirt bike and practice sliding both ends in lefthanders, righthanders, hills, you name it. That is a much better approach to more safety. It's more fun too.
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Madduck
Posted on Thursday, December 07, 2006 - 12:38 pm:   Edit Post Delete Post View Post/Check IP Print Post    Move Post (Custodian/Admin Only) Ban Poster IP (Custodian/Admin only)

I have many years riding experience with all versions of the BMW ABS system. A few times it has helped, more times it has caused problems. In the wet it stops faster, no question about it. When the traction is really bad, wet leaves, frosty steel bridge and gravel on roadway it tends to make braking problems worse. No matter how good your brakes they will not "protect" you from "stupid". I drive as if there is a nice load of gravel waiting just out of site.
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Plowman
Posted on Thursday, December 07, 2006 - 06:01 pm:   Edit Post Delete Post View Post/Check IP Print Post    Move Post (Custodian/Admin Only) Ban Poster IP (Custodian/Admin only)

Thanks for the info. I want an American bike. the MSF course seems to be the bet,er option to the ABS that is currently available. Thanks for the advise,
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Ka5ysy
Posted on Thursday, December 07, 2006 - 06:43 pm:   Edit Post Delete Post View Post/Check IP Print Post    Move Post (Custodian/Admin Only) Ban Poster IP (Custodian/Admin only)

The new BMW ABS system works... I had occasion to run a new R1200R and was curious what the brakes did. At 65mph, dry pavement, stood on the rear and literally grabbed the front brake just like you are not supposed to do, so simulate a panic stop.

Result: Bike stopped fully under control in 105 feet measured. No stoppies, no rear lockup, just very strong brakes and it feels like you have dropped anchor.

Since most are aware of the servo brake problems, this new system is not power assisted, and does not pulse when active. The only thing I noticed after the stop was the ABS controller rattling. The brake feel is precisely like non-abs brakes and you have brakes without the electrical system online.

All things considered, I will take this system over a non-abs bike. We are in a combat zone and everyone is out to kill us, so why not have all the survival systems available?
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Red_chili
Posted on Friday, December 08, 2006 - 09:24 am:   Edit Post Delete Post View Post/Check IP Print Post    Move Post (Custodian/Admin Only) Ban Poster IP (Custodian/Admin only)

Result: Bike stopped fully under control in 105 feet measured. No stoppies, ...
Yeah, I'm with you, that's the showstopper right there. No ABS for me!
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Red_chili
Posted on Friday, December 08, 2006 - 09:34 am:   Edit Post Delete Post View Post/Check IP Print Post    Move Post (Custodian/Admin Only) Ban Poster IP (Custodian/Admin only)

Along those lines...
I was riding my Duc a decade ago in a canyon, and came up on some bluehairs (better use that one while I can) doing 25mph in a posted 35. Double yellow, poor vis of oncoming.

Patience, grasshopper.

Finally there was room and visibility, if I did not dawdle. Wicked it up, passed safely, tucked into a right hander then a lefthander, exited under power...

and saw the county sheriff walking out in front of me motioning me to the shoulder.

Let's say by that time I was moving... briskly. So briskly in fact that I was not sure if the deputy was going to be a front fender decoration.

So I came to a stop in a long, sustained slight brakie, turning slightly to the shoulder, and killed the motor. Took off my helmet and prepared to be cuffed or something. Or at least of significantly less net worth.

He said "license and registration", that I needed to slow down, and what was that box on the triple clamp? (Radar detector... oh crum). He thought that was pretty neat how I had my helmet wired with the speaker from it, asked Joe to aim the gun at it (it went off), told me he had not gotten a good clock on me but take it down a couple notches, and have a nice day.

Uhhhhhhhhh..... yessir.

(He was a motorcycle cop, and I do believe the controlled, sustained brakie on a red/white/green Ducati kinda impressed him. YMMV.)








Sold the Ducati not long after that...

(Message edited by Red_Chili on December 08, 2006)
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Chadhargis
Posted on Friday, December 08, 2006 - 12:39 pm:   Edit Post Delete Post View Post/Check IP Print Post    Move Post (Custodian/Admin Only) Ban Poster IP (Custodian/Admin only)

Great story!

Must be something about Ducatis. When I had my Ducati Red M900, I was stuck behind a car on an interstate exit ramp. The sucker wouldn't go! Traffic was clear, and he just sat there jawing on his bloomin' cell phone. So I eased up next to him on the right. It was at night, and I could see headlights coming a safe distance away, so I shot out into the street into a nice wheelie with the Staintunes roaring. The car in the distance was a cop. : (

Got a ticket for an illegal pass, but no mention of the wheelie or loud pipes.
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Old_mil
Posted on Friday, December 08, 2006 - 04:41 pm:   Edit Post Delete Post View Post/Check IP Print Post    Move Post (Custodian/Admin Only) Ban Poster IP (Custodian/Admin only)

With the Aprilia - and likely with the Tiger - consider that 99% of those roads that you're going to spend 99% of your time on are going to be hundreds of miles from the nearest dealer...and int he case of the Aprilia, at least, thousands of miles from the nearest replacement parts.

I've ridden BMWs for some years, and though they had ABS, I never had occasion to use it. It did increase the complexity, etc, of the braking system. At least in BMWs case, I'd be more concerned about running into a situation where low/reduced power situations or a rough pavement would reduce braking effectiveness rather than actually running into a situation where ABS would make the difference between crashing and not crashing.
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Stevenknapp
Posted on Saturday, December 09, 2006 - 10:27 pm:   Edit Post Delete Post View Post/Check IP Print Post    Move Post (Custodian/Admin Only) Ban Poster IP (Custodian/Admin only)

Both of my ABS bikes were BMW's servo assist system. I think that setup is geared towards panics and low skill sets. It did cause me more problems than did good. The non-servo setups are probably not as much an issue.

Any of these bikes will offer better performance than your cruiser. All will require some practice for panic braking, even with the ABS.
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