| Author | Message | ||
     Ft_bstrd |
I am interested to know how widespread the problem actually is. I have a great dealership that I deal with and plan on forwarding the results to Buell through them. Ok, here's the deal. If you are having problems with your fan let's collect some data. What is your bike's manufacture date? When did a problem fan first begin to make itself known (mileage)? When was the fan deemed dead by the dealer and replaced? Let's go guys, fess up!!!!!!!! Chief Manuf Date: 12/05 Beginning Mileage Problem: 6,000 Failure Mileage: Not yet replaced Brad1445 Manuf Date: 09/05 Beginning Mileage Problem: 6,000 Failure Mileage: Not Yet Replaced Xbimmer Manuf Date: 05/06 Beginning Mileage Problem: 5,500 Failure Mileage: Not Yet Replaced Aeholton Manuf Date: Jul 05 Beginning Mileage Problem: ~11,500 Failure Mileage: ~11,500 Lorazepam Manuf Date: 11/05 Beginning Mileage Problem: 5,000 Failure Mileage: 5,000 Debueller Manuf Date: ???? Beginning Mileage Problem: 15,000 Failure Mileage: Not Yet Replaced Retired Cop Manuf Date: 09/05 Beginning Mileage Problem: 7,000 Failure Mileage: Not Yet Replaced ChadHargis Manuf Date: 11/05 Beginning Mileage Problem: 5,000 Failure Mileage: 5,000 (Message edited by ft_bstrd on September 05, 2006) | ||
| Chief |
Failed at 6,000 miles (Message edited by chief on September 05, 2006) | ||
| Ft_bstrd |
What is your manufacture date, Chief? | ||
| Xbimmer |
Mfg 10/05. Purchased new 05/06. If you want to consider a progressively noisier rattling bearing as failure, then it began somewhere around 5500 miles. Today at just under 8k it became noisier, a vibration can be felt through the seat and frame beams in the vicinity when it's running. Maybe that was there before, not positive. If you want total failure then I'll update, might not have to wait too long... | ||
| Chief |
Mfg 12/05 | ||
| Brad1445 |
If you want to consider a progressively noisier rattling bearing as failure, then it began somewhere around 6000 miles. | ||
| Ft_bstrd |
Brad, Manufacture Date? | ||
| Ft_bstrd |
Let's amend the info list. When did the bearings begin to indicate an impending problem (begin to rattle)? When was the fan deemed to be "dead" by the dealer and replaced? (Message edited by ft_bstrd on September 05, 2006) | ||
| Brad1445 |
sept 05 manufacture date here, sorry for missing that. | ||
| Court |
There is a nice fellow at Buell who has tons of data on this. The problem with the internet is that it gives a terrilby unrepresentative view of a problem. It looks, and I know it's low, if you use the data on this page you see 3 "failures" (and it appears failure includes objectionable noise. Take that in the Ulysses (ignore for a minute that all XB's use the same fan) and you get something on the order of 0.0003%. Most manufacturers would die for that level of reliability. The BEST (and most prodcutive thing) you can do is to ensure your individual expereinces are properly reported to your dealer. I think there is a basis for looking at this but don;t want good meaning folks to accidently "prove" the opposite of what they set out to. Just a thought. | ||
| Davo |
.0003% failure rate? That means they produce 333,333 bikes for each failure? Maybe they should watch the internet for some more grass roots feed back and do away with the surveys. | ||
| Aeholton |
Manuf Date: Jul 05 Beginning Mileage Problem: Didn't notice a problem before failure. Failure Mileage: ~11,500 | ||
| Aeholton |
The problem with the internet is that it gives a terrilby unrepresentative view of a problem. It looks, and I know it's low, if you use the data on this page you see 3 "failures" (and it appears failure includes objectionable noise. I agree a poll on Badweb is not representative of the Buell population as a whole, but it would be nice to see how many BadWebbers had actual fan failures (not noisy fans). Further, you need to give people a little more time to respond before declaring only 3 failures. The original post was entered yesterday after 9pm and with your tally coming just after 6:30am today. | ||
| Jlnance |
There is a nice fellow at Buell who has tons of data on this. I realize that manufacturers are reluctant to do this, but perhaps in the spirit of "different in every sense," Buell could be convinced to publish their defect information online? I know it would have made a lot of people feel better to know that Buell was aware of the sidestand problem. | ||
| Lorazepam |
Mine died around 5k miles. as in wouldnt spin when hot, but worked when cold. | ||
| Debueller |
Started getting noisy at about 15K. Still working at 26,220, but is very noisy. | ||
| Retired_cop |
Started to make a bit of noise at 7K but still working at 8K. Prod Date Sept 05 | ||
| Chadhargis |
Fatty: Did your fan go tits up? As you know, mine went south about 5000 miles. My bike was manufactured the same month and year as yours. I've had no other problems with my bike. | ||
| Lorazepam |
my mfg date is nov 05 | ||
| Ft_bstrd |
Debueller, Manuf Date? | ||
| Ft_bstrd |
Posted on Tuesday, September 05, 2006 - 12:07 pm: -------------------------------------------------------------------------------- Fatty: Did your fan go tits up? As you know, mine went south about 5000 miles. My bike was manufactured the same month and year as yours. I've had no other problems with my bike. Nope. I have had no issues with my fan. No noises. Nothing. I would just like to see how many fans have actually failed, how many have been replaced, and see if there is a manufacturing date or date range that coincides with the failure. If all the bikes manufactured from 9/05 through 12/05 have the failures and there are no outliers beyond a particular manufacture date, we can draw some conclusions as to when the fans fail and what production runs are affected. It is a small sampling, but if we were going to get a sampling anywhere, this is a good place to start. | ||
| M2nc |
My fan is fine at 13K. Production in Sept 05 | ||
| Debueller |
Bstrd, Bike manu. date Sept,05 I have a appt. at dealer next week for a new fan. (Message edited by debueller on September 06, 2006) | ||
| Lorazepam |
I also live on a gravel road, and mine sees dust almost every ride. The new fan is starting to scream, but it was one the tech had and wasnt in inventory. It hasnt begun the slowing down as it gets hot routine, but it is louder than my race pipe. | ||
| Husky |
I'm a potential Uly owner, and wonder if any of you have taken a fan apart and looked at the bearings. Are they double metal shielded and rubber sealed (shields and seals seals on each side of the bearing) ball bearings? Did the seals look like they were still sealing on the surface of the bearing inner race or were they kind of rough and ragged looking and not making full contact with the inner race? Has anyone popped one of the seals to check the lubrication on a noisy bearing or on one that isn't noisy? What did you see-any sign of grease or was it dry and maybe even gritty? If they aren't sealed with high temp seals (viton) and lubricated with high temp. synthetic grease then we can fix that and probably greatly extend their life. Have the brushes looked worn out and maybe chipped? Is the armature commutator still smooth or is it badly worn from dirt and sticking/worn out brushes? Was there grit inside the fan motor? Is the motor designed as a sealed explosion proof device (no openings in it to allow air to get in or out of the motor where the bearings and brushes are)? Every bit of input will help! Regards, Joe | ||
| Whodom |
Husky, Check out this earlier thread with photos of a failed fan: http://www.badweatherbikers.com/buell/messages/142838/222848.html | ||
| Husky |
Thanks Whodom, that helps. From the pictures it looks like one end of the motor housing One brush does have some damage, but maybe some of that occurred during disassembly. The brushes are carbon. Its also hard to determine the amount of scoring on the commutator from the picture. The picture does not show the bearing seals or shields or the condition of what looks like seals on the housing where the motor shaft protrudes through. Need more input folks! Maybe Chief will take some more pictures, of each end inside and outside of the ends of the housing parts. I and interested in pictures of the ball bearings and how they are mounted in the housings. Are there any seals installed from the outside of the housings? What is that disk shaped part on the armature shaft, right next to the commutator? Regards, Joe | ||
| Ft_bstrd |
Fans that won't move have one of three major issues: Lack of power Broken internals (brushes, etc.) Seized bearings/broken seals There doesn't seem to be a power interruption. If the fan still spins easily, the bearings aren't seized, but the internals might be fried. If the bearings aren't seized, but the seals are faulty, foreign objects will break down the internals. Lastly, if the bearings aren't seized and the seals are still good, there must be a reason the internals are fried. Is it heat? I can't imagine that even 450 degree heat would damage the internals. I have a fan in my oven that runs at temps up to 550 degrees. There just seemed to be a bunch of crap inside that fan case just to be destroyed internals. It looked like the inside of a cracked CV boot. | ||
| Husky |
Fatty, Is the fan up or down stream of the heat source? Where exactly is it mounted? Picture? I remember a post where some cylinder head temperatures were listed during some right side scoop tests. What are they normally? Is one end of the fan housing real close to very hot parts like exhaust pipes or cylinder heads and upper cylinder fins? The grunge you are talking about in the housing could be grease mixed with water and then heated until all of the lighter lubricants have been cooked off and you are left with the lubricant base (lithium, aluminum, sodium etc. The seals on the ball bearings, if there are any, could have failed and allowed the grease to be flung out of the bearings. There are lots of senarios, they could have over packed the bearings with cheap grease which got too hot from the engine plus self heating caused by spinning an over packed bearing fast, which could have caused the majority of the grease to be flung out into the housing and also damaged the remaining grease's lubricating capability by drying it out. The brush to commutator interface does not like this crap either it increases the contact resistance causing extreme heat at the interface. The windings in the picture Chief posted do not look like they are burned at all, so those components were able to tolerate the environment. More information please! I'm just a dumb s#*t with Buells but I do know about this stuff. Regards, Joe | ||
| Ft_bstrd |
The fan is directly behind and above the rear cylinder head. It pulls hot air off the rear cylinder head and cylinder through itself and out the rear seat assembly above the rear hugger. It is directly along the central axis of the bike just below your crotch. My concern is that if what is caking the inside of the casing is cooked off lubricant, it wasn't the correct lubricant. |
