| Author |
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Jim_sb
| | Posted on Wednesday, October 19, 2005 - 01:34 pm: | 
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Hello Buellgrrrl, my 4 years of S2 ownership have been far different than you suggest.
Spark plugs, oil, filters, etc. have all been available from any local HD / Buell / Indy shop. Easy stuff. Very easy to shop on price too because everyone has it.
Buell specific stuff that is a bit harder to find (brake pads for example) are typically in stock with Al at American Sportbike. They'll be in your hands as fast as you want them.
Other items (the rubber donut that tore) did not strand me anywhere. I rode the bike home, ordered the part and had it in 3 days. Probably could have had it sooner if I were willing to pay air freight.
So my experience is very unlike yours. My S2 has been very reliable, easy to service and maintain, no parts issues, etc.
Additionally I suspect the XB Buells have received more engineering attention than the tube framers did which should result in a more reliable product from the outset.
Time will tell.
I had really bad luck with a Ford I bought in the 70's. I had great luck with one I bought in the 90's. Still do.
At this point your 'rain' is unwarranted.
Regards,
Jim in Santa Barbara |
Thunderbox
| | Posted on Wednesday, October 19, 2005 - 01:42 pm: |
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I wanted to ask Buellgirl if the 8th part they didn't have prevented the job from being done just the same. So i wouldn't matter if they had 99 out of 100 parts if you still had to wait for the last piece. |
Jim_sb
| | Posted on Wednesday, October 19, 2005 - 01:44 pm: |
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Couple more points. The 6000 mile valve adjustment requirement, shaft drive problems (more frequent than you'd guess and not cheap to fix), the tendency for the boxer twin to consume oil and leave deposits on pistons, valves, etc.
Don't get me wrong, I think it's a wonderful bike. One of my best friends rode a new one home Friday.
We're already planning some trips and I'll be able to compare how they do first hand. His GS and my Uly.
Should be fun.
Jim in Santa Barbara |
Thunderbox
| | Posted on Wednesday, October 19, 2005 - 01:47 pm: |
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Jim you may have to drop that person from your friends list now that he has a BMW. You know the rules for owning a Buell. But seriously whatever you do keep an eye on him as he will be preoccupied trying to pass you all the time. Happens when you have to follow someone for too long. LMAO |
Jim_sb
| | Posted on Wednesday, October 19, 2005 - 02:22 pm: |
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Thunderbox, LOL!
BUT, he also owns a stunning (multiple award winning and magazine published) 435 lb. Caf'e Sportster (95 rwhp), a stunning S1 White Lightning and a new XR650 (for when we really want to play in the dirt).
So you see? He is a Buell owner. 
Jim in Santa Barbara |
Lowflyer
| | Posted on Wednesday, October 19, 2005 - 03:33 pm: |
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Buellgrrl,
There is no use BSing a BSer. I think you were all to happy to rain on this parade, or you would have picked a more suitable thread. You are quite obviously a Bimmeron who is quite jealous of the positive press for the new Uly.
What you wrote was like me saying (and don't take this the wrong way) , "I don't mean to be rude but, but I think you are an idiot." |
Chadhargis
| | Posted on Wednesday, October 19, 2005 - 04:41 pm: |
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Correct me if I'm wrong...but hasn't the XB engine been made since 2002? That means it's in it's 4th model year. Ok..the tranny is a new design, but I'm assuming they improved on the old one.
I'm sorry, I don't buy the "new model" syndrome. Sure, there are bugs in new designs, but with modern R&D, CAD software, testing, etc...this is largely a myth. They have simulators that can put 200,000 miles of wear on a bike in a few days. I have a friend who's dad worked for a large GM division, and he said they used to bench test engines at redline for DAYS at a time to test durability. They would even abuse them by running them low on oil for long periods of time to see how long it took them to fail.
What amazes me is how much dislike there is out there for Buell. I just did a track day over the weekend. I was riding my Ducati, and told someone that I was buying a Buell. They laughed and said, "I've seen those things shake parts off on the track. Saw one drop its oil filter because it vibrated loose. They are pieces of $hit. Good luck with yours."
I've done a good bit of research on the bikes, and I've never heard of one single person saying they've had parts fall off their bike, or that the XB models were anything but reliable.
Why are people so against Buells? I don't think Ural makes a very good bike, but I'm not going to go around slamming them, especially on a Ural forum.  |
Thunderbox
| | Posted on Wednesday, October 19, 2005 - 05:27 pm: |
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I would bet if you did a demographic on this subject you would find the average age of the Buell owner is a fair bit higher than the average age for the ricers. So having said that it is only reasonable to say it is a knowledge and maturity issue. They bad mouth Buell because they don't know any better and they are not overly mature. I could have been one of those people in the past but I'm too friggin old now LOL.
The other factor is those who ride Buells are strongly Buell loyal. Those who ride ricers are only interested in specifications and therefore have no loyalty whatsoever. Each year a new HP champ comes along and they run over to the dealer and get the newest fastest deadliest machine money can buy. Why is that anyway? Because when it comes down to it they are not overly satisfied with the ride they have and are constantly in search of something better. Most of us did that until Buell discovered us. So when someone says a Buell is a POS I just smile and say "I guess thats true you know just about everything there is to know about bikes". Then when we stop for a coffee and we come out everyone is looking not at the Yamy, not the Hondu, nor the Kawi, everyone wants to know about the Buell. I politely answer their questions, put on the full face and laugh all the way to the highway. But you asked why are people so against Buell? I really don't know but more importantly I really don't care.
I always say "if you aren't riding a Buell you may as well be walking".
I am very happy to be among the found, the few and the honoured. |
Chadhargis
| | Posted on Wednesday, October 19, 2005 - 05:55 pm: |
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I've never owned a Buell, and never really gave them much thought until I was hanging out with a fellow MSF instructor at a Harley dealership where he was teaching that weekend. The owner of the dealership offer me a test ride on both an XB12S and XB9R. I loved the bikes, but they were too small for my 6'5" frame. When I saw the Uly, I knew it was the bike for me. I love torquey V-Twins, and I don't give a rats behind for top end horsepower (except when I'm getting passed on the track! My Ducati is only laying down about 75hp). For the street, torque is king, and the Buell has it in spades. It's also fairly light. As close to a sportbike as I can be comfortable on.
I don't really want an "adventure" bike so much as I want a "big sportbike". Something that fits me comfortably, yet is still fun in the twisties. That leaves me to choose between the Multistrada and the Uly. I have a Ducati, I know how expensive they are to maintain. I love it, but it's not the right bike to have as your main ride. Too expensive to service!
I believe in objectivity. I have done my due dilligence on the Uly, and I believe it's a sound motorcycle. If not, well, I guess I lose. I can't understand why people want to run them down. Especially when they know nothing about them, have never ridden one, and haven't done a fraction of the research I've done on the bike. |
Bomber
| | Posted on Wednesday, October 19, 2005 - 06:12 pm: |
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wow -- no dissenting opinions allowed it would seem --
Blake caught all the inconsistancies in the MCN piece, or at least he caught more than I did ;-}
my experience nirrors his in terms of parts availability (but I drank the Dave Kool-aid some time ago, so I no longer have to wiat on parts {nuther smiley})
that said, even the most fanatic Buell fan will have to admit that the dealership issue will likely be a limiting one for first time Buell buyers (or lookers) . . . while I doubt that any Ulys will be sitting waiting for an 8K offer, fact is that most Buell riders have developed a series of workarounds that allow them to deal with a less than sterling supplier network (with the obvious exceptions) -- workarounds are great, but won't impress someone who walks into a dealership wanting to check out the new Uly, only to have an employee try to talk them out of their interest and try to sell em a Vrod -- I've seen it happen in the last week, and I find it tough to believe that it's an isolated occurance
sounds like honorable people disagreeing to me, which should be encouraged, methinks
they are both good scoots, but it sounds like Ms Grrl's had a pretty wretched (some might say typical) dealer experience (weeks for an 01 part? call Dave, Grrl -- I know it's a workaround, but it works)
there are some who say the Uly will be the driving factor in an HD dealership turnaround vis a vis Buells -- I hope that's the case, truly, it would be nice to see the brand build on it's strengths, rather than in spite of the weakness of the supply chain |
Lowflyer
| | Posted on Wednesday, October 19, 2005 - 06:39 pm: |
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Dissention is the mother of invention. (Did I just make that up?) I have no problem with dissenting opinions. I do have a problem with chickens*** opinions camouflaged beneath layers of feigned objectivity and BS comparisons. In other words, if you don't like Buells just come out with it honestly. Don't make s*** up about "7 out of 8 parts bla..bla..bla..."
I'm sorry if you bought into that line of BS. If you read BMergrrl's post carefully you will see through it. She sets you up by saying "Sorry..." This is to put you at ease. Then, she dings both Bimmers and Buells in order to feign objectivity and make us all think she has done some homework. Finally, she delivers the punch line which is "Buells suck" in not so many words. The reasons people do this vary, but mostly I think it is due to overwhelming feelings of inadequacy stemming from a fear of having bought the wrong bike. It is a classic driveby thread slam. Let's all learn from it and move on.  |
Bomber
| | Posted on Thursday, October 20, 2005 - 09:21 am: |
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Low -- I did, in fact read the post fairly critically -- I don't get the sense that the poster hates buells at all -- feels screwed, blued and tatooed by the lcoal (?) dealer, yep, but a hater of buells, I didn't get that message at all
but, honorable people disagree all the time, I'm thinkin . . ..
smile |
Lowflyer
| | Posted on Thursday, October 20, 2005 - 10:09 am: |
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I didn't mean to accuse you of not reading it carefully enough. I meant only to sound analytical. I see your point.
However, call me a cynic, but I have seen that pattern too many times to believe that she really has any real problems with a dealer. I think most people that post bona fide dealer problems will focus on the dealer, their poor bike, and the problem specifically. They tend to not delve into some bogus comparison between Buell and some other OEM and then make a prediction as to the continued well-being of Buell. Only people with hidden BS agendas write that way. |
Bomber
| | Posted on Thursday, October 20, 2005 - 02:32 pm: |
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Low -- yer rigfht, there does seem to be a pattern to many folk's trolling techniques (grin) --
in any event, I'd LOVE to be abke to pick up a new Uly for 8Gs, but it ain't gonna happen, bad for me, good for Buell |
Blake
| | Posted on Thursday, October 20, 2005 - 06:08 pm: |
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Buellgrrrl did indeed post elsewhere about her frustrations. I am hesitant to think she's a Buell bashing troll. Though I do also see Low's point. The all to common troll-like approach to Buell bashing is indeed suspicious. I simply disagree with what I view as gross over-generalizations and silly unsupportable conclusions. What I would like is for Buellgrrrl to have her Cyclone back on the road and running great.  She has email from me to that effect offering help. No response yet. She must be busy.
I certainly would like to be able to thoughtfully rebut such posts without BadWeB being plastered with the bullshit characterization that "wow -- no dissenting opinions allowed it would seem --".
Bomber, you know that is BS. It seems as though if the folks at SacBORG repeat that assertion enough it has finally taken hold with some perceived validity.
All constructive Buell related discourse is welcomed here. No exceptions. Sorry to sound so harsh, but that accusation that we don't allow opposing views here is one of my very very sorest spots. And you done poked it with a sharp stick young man!
I just don't understand how it is supposed to be that if my opinion or those of others differs on the positive side of an issue from one on the negative, that expressing OUR opinion in rebuttal is somehow an effort to stifle open discussion. What the hell are we supposed to do, nod our heads and mutter uh-huh, though we disagree? LOL! I ain't made that way.
Let the dabate rage!
Back to MCN...
Anyone see what they had the gall to publish concerning the HD Rider's Edge course. Unbelievably irresponsible journalism. It was in the September or October issue in the article comparing the various motorcycle safety classes and curiculums.
I have my renewal notice sitting atop the to-pay stack of bills right in front of me. Not sure I'm going to renew or not. Might be an ego thing. I only subscribe to three moto mags... "Cycle-World", "Road Racing World and Motorcycle Technology", and "Motorcycle Consumer News." Concerning accuracy and objectivity in reporting, I never have any problems with RRW; I sometimes have problems with CW; I ALWAYS have problems with MCN. Not to say that they don't also offer some great content.
More debate is good. |
Jlnance
| | Posted on Thursday, October 20, 2005 - 06:53 pm: |
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Correct me if I'm wrong...but hasn't the XB engine been made since 2002? That means it's in it's 4th model year. Ok..the tranny is a new design, but I'm assuming they improved on the old one.
I'm sorry, I don't buy the "new model" syndrome.
I don't recall any changes to the engine since 2002, but there is a lot more on the bike than an engine.
I know the belt has been updated twice since 2002, and the pulley was changed with one of those upgrades. There was a problem with the engine getting starved for fuel during certain manuvers that was fixed. I think there was a problem with one of the bulbs shorting out, which was also fixed. The 2006 transmissions are substantially different than the earlier ones.
I don't think the 2002 XBs were bad bikes, but they are certainly better now. I wouldn't hesitate to buy a Uly, but I'm sure next years model will be better. |
Buellgrrrl
| | Posted on Thursday, October 20, 2005 - 07:23 pm: |
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Buellgrrl belatedly responds:
You guys may not believe this, but I once got throw off a BMW list for saying nice things about Buell. Some BMW riders get all too obsessively, blindly, loyal to the brand. It really sticks in their craw when I point out that the spawn of the demon Motor Company of Milwaukee could produce a bike like the M2 that is the equal of BMW for thousands less. Sadly, it seems that a few Uly fans are copying this blind loyalty, perhaps to counterattack the arrogance of some BMW riders.
Buellgrrrl calls 'em like she sees 'em- having been served a lemon by BMW ('92 R100GS) I went looking elsewhere. Before settling on the M2 I sampled the Guzzi Stone (cruiser ergos didn't agree with my aging joints), BMW oilhead (too heavy), and even some Japenese offerings (shaft drives too heavy and I haven't lubed a chain since '84). The Buell won out, and if the parts availability and service were as good as the bike I'd be selling more Buells than anyone except Dave in Appleton, and I wouldn't even expect a commission.
Buellgrrrl |
Lowflyer
| | Posted on Thursday, October 20, 2005 - 10:31 pm: |
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<<I wouldn't hesitate to buy a Uly, but I'm sure next years model will be better.>>
You are right. There is never a 'perfect' time to buy anything. If you wait around, you'll just watch everybody else having the same experience that you will have when you do decide to buy. The problems will be different, but they will be there and the models will improve year after year until they're discontinued.
Buellgrrrl,
I agree that brand loyalty is annoying. However, I suspect that what you have experienced in here is simply a result of a certain lack of objectivity in your original post. You will find that folks tend to get defensive when you attack. People in here have thousands of $$ tied up in many different brands of bikes and they tend to take notice of broad generalizations about a particular brand or model in which they have invested. That is not brand loyalty, it's human nature. I have seen where these guys are very empathetic and helpful when real problems are posted no matter what the brand. Most of us are careful not to trash entire brand names or models.
That said, I apologize if I have mischaracterized your intent. |
Chadhargis
| | Posted on Friday, October 21, 2005 - 02:09 pm: |
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Seems to me that most of the bugs mentioned above are easy fixes. New belt, new sprocket, new light, etc.
New tranny not included, it seems to very similar to the other Buells. I'm hoping it's a reliable bike capable of taking well maintained abuse. I might just get bold and do a track day on it! LOL! |
Bomber
| | Posted on Friday, October 21, 2005 - 05:27 pm: |
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Blake -- sorry to have neglected the sarcasm emoticon (not which one it is, in any event) -- tell ya what, I'll try to be more specific about humorous posts, or, rather, in this case, humorous portions of a post responding to slagging someone else's obviously frustrated post (I believve I can remember a frustrated post or two coming out over your signature from time to time) ---
I'll do that if you try, for five minutes a day, to not assume the worst about someone elses post (doesn't even have to be mine), not assume that every utterence is aimed at you or your board (could be aimed at other writers, ya know), and feel the urge to lecture, but let it pass on by.
deal? |
Blake
| | Posted on Saturday, October 22, 2005 - 02:51 am: |
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It's that darn sore spot. Shoulda knowns better though. You're way to good of a man to think otherwise.
Should I put the sarcasm emoticon on that last comment? Hmmmm. 
Thanks for being you Bomber.
Deal. But keep reminding me, okay? |
Bomber
| | Posted on Saturday, October 22, 2005 - 12:10 pm: |
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Blake -- no foul, sir -- as for the reminding dealio, think I'll pass -- it would get bothersome for both of us, and that reminding going back and forth goodness knows we can both use the helpo, but their are others in our lives who are in much better positions to do so, I'm thinkin
grin |
Blake
| | Posted on Saturday, October 22, 2005 - 08:26 pm: |
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Yes dear, whatever you say, dear. ![: ]](http://www.badweatherbikers.com/buell/clipart/proud.gif) |
M2nc
| | Posted on Sunday, October 23, 2005 - 10:56 am: |
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To say that Buell's dealer network needs help is an understatement, but that is not going to keep me away from Buells. I can get to four HD/Buell dealers before I can get to the first BMW dealer. (Yes, I'm out in the boonies).
Buell and BMW both make good products. From what I have seen from XBs though, the Buells have closed the gaps in quality and can rival the BMWs now. It again falls down to what do you want out of the bike. If you are on the pavement just to get to the next path, the BMW is going to be more for you. If you are on the dirt because you can but spend most of your time on the pavement, then the Buell will reign King. That is what the reviews of the article are telling me anyway and I have to tend to agree.
(Message edited by M2nc on October 23, 2005) |
S1eric
| | Posted on Sunday, October 23, 2005 - 12:08 pm: |
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I`m not sure about the dealerships in your area,
So I can`t dispute your experiences.
but I have seen vast improvements in my area
over the last 3 years. So much so that I`m really
impressed. (not an easy thing to do).
Been riding Buells for 10 years. Other brands alot longer. And the parts distribution for Buell is far better than the others.
My garage seems to be the local workshop for many
riders. I recently worked on an XB that was flipped. (Imagine that) Busted primary, Broken shift lever the list goes on and on. The parts that weren`t in stock had to be ordered.
Everything made it in 3 Days.
Even when I work on my tubers it`s the same results.
Walked into dealership this past Tuesday, Ordered
some old tuber parts. I get a call from the dealership on Friday at 1:30. My parts are waiting on me.
Thats good service. THANKS BUELL !
These are the results from two different dealerships in my area. And one just started carrying Buell A couple of years ago.
From what I`m seeing, I think new Uly owners will be getting good service.
That is if you are lucky enough to get a new ULY.
I don`t see them sitting in showrooms for very long. And I can`t get A Uly owner to stop riding long enough to ask about there dealership experience. But it looks positive.
S1Eric |
Chadhargis
| | Posted on Sunday, October 23, 2005 - 07:38 pm: |
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You guys ought to try owning a Ducati. Parts come on a slow boat from Italy. Two weeks to a month for some parts is "normal". I've heard of people waiting three months for simple body parts.
Shipping from East Troy, WI should be considerably faster. |
Homer
| | Posted on Sunday, October 23, 2005 - 07:41 pm: |
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Yep, I wrecked my buddies Aprillia the beginning of June - it's still in the shop waiting on parts. I managed to heal a broken shoulder quicker than they could get parts for his bike. |
Court
| | Posted on Monday, October 24, 2005 - 04:58 am: |
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>>>I have seen vast improvements in my area
over the last 3 years. So much so that I`m really
impressed.
Expect continued improvement |
Blake
| | Posted on Wednesday, October 26, 2005 - 03:26 am: |
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Found another error in the MCN data on the Uly, they report a service interval of only 2,500 miles for the Uly and 6,000 miles for the GS.
The Uly service interval is 5,000 miles. |
Chadhargis
| | Posted on Monday, October 31, 2005 - 10:32 am: |
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Blake...I agree with you. The maintenance table clearly states 5000 mile intervals. But I'm about half way through reading my service manual (yes, the entire manual cover to cover), and there is a nice little blurb burried in there that says (I don't have the manual with me, so I'm paraphrasing), "if you operate the engine in temps greater than 80 degrees, make frequent short trips, or ride at over 70mph, change the engine oil every 2,500 miles".
That quote is not exact, but it's close. I know I'll be riding in over 80 degree temps and WELL over 70mph. So I guess I'll be on the MCN stated 2500 mile interval. |
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